Leeds Bradford Airport

BIG N · Post by **BIG N** » Fri 19 Oct, 2012 1:51 am

cnosni wrote: simong wrote: The unanswered but obvious question is, does Yeadon get a stop as well after a hundred years of not having one? Well here is another thing,what would the route be from the airport to Guiseley,would the topography allow it and if so where?I would imagine it would be the light rail side of things on such a stretch and perhaps there will be a tram stop rather than a heavy rail station. If its a tram/light rail system then the topography wouldn't be much of a problem for the Guiseley, have you been to Sheffield and seen some of the dive unders and climbs on their system.What's got me a little confused unless I've missed something of course is this - there's talk of the intended system operating in places over sections of existing heavy rail, how would this be powered ? Because I'm pretty sure theres no light rail system that operates at 25kv

Keg · Post by **Keg** » Wed 24 Oct, 2012 1:51 pm

Perhaps i am being old and boring but i do not see how the tram or trolleybus is going to solve the transport problems of the city.Will they share the same road space as cars?- if yes, then no benefit over a bus. If no then use that space as a guided bus route. These can then come off the guides and go "round the houses".Are these a real solution or a "nice to have" so it allows us to keep up with other cities.Building some more roads rather than cutting capacity on the current ones might helpThe underground idea is just a pipe dream, way too expensive.The rail link to LBA is a good idea, Horsforth across to either Guisley or Menston would be a good route. I live in Rawdon and there are plans to include a lot of the land around the area in the plan for possible housing development so if they want to build the line they need to get a move on.LBA is a conumdrum. It has its uses as a holiday airport and for some business flights but until it gets a regular US route(s) and some more long haul operators, it will be just that, a small local aiport.Even Heathrow does not charge for droppping off so why LBA's owners think they can charge it, god only knows. I just walk up the road and get somone to pick me up there.

Johnny39 · Post by **Johnny39** » Wed 24 Oct, 2012 2:23 pm

L-B is rather difficult to get to from York and further north-eastwards. True you don't have to go into the city of Leeds but there is no major road I can think of from the north-east of the county to the airport. Humberside and Doncaster are more accessible but don't have the same choice of destinations.

raveydavey · Post by **raveydavey** » Wed 24 Oct, 2012 9:55 pm

Johnny39 wrote: L-B is rather difficult to get to from York and further north-eastwards. True you don't have to go into the city of Leeds but there is no major road I can think of from the north-east of the county to the airport. Humberside and Doncaster are more accessible but don't have the same choice of destinations. I think it's accepted now that LBA is in the wrong place, but I guess we're stuck with it.IIRC, traffic heading down the A1 is directed off at Harrogate onto the A59 and then around the A658 to the south of the town and (eventually) up Pool bank - a fairly tortuous single carriageway route.Traffic from the York area either follows the same looping route, or comes via Collingham and Harewood on the equally indirect A659 to Pool bank - the York Airport bus follows that route and only just fits round some corners betwixt Harewood and Pool.I'm still not convinced by the planned "tram train" route. Other than the airport I'm unclear who will it serve. Do many people need to get to Guiseley from Horsforth (or vice versa) via public transport?

Johnny39 · Post by **Johnny39** » Wed 24 Oct, 2012 10:40 pm

raveydavey wrote: Johnny39 wrote: L-B is rather difficult to get to from York and further north-eastwards. True you don't have to go into the city of Leeds but there is no major road I can think of from the north-east of the county to the airport. Humberside and Doncaster are more accessible but don't have the same choice of destinations. I think it's accepted now that LBA is in the wrong place, but I guess we're stuck with it.IIRC, traffic heading down the A1 is directed off at Harrogate onto the A59 and then around the A658 to the south of the town and (eventually) up Pool bank - a fairly tortuous single carriageway route.Traffic from the York area either follows the same looping route, or comes via Collingham and Harewood on the equally indirect A659 to Pool bank - the York Airport bus follows that route and only just fits round some corners betwixt Harewood and Pool.I'm still not convinced by the planned "tram train" route. Other than the airport I'm unclear who will it serve. Do many people need to get to Guiseley from Horsforth (or vice versa) via public transport? Hi Ravey - coming from Scarborough we pretty much do as you would from York only we go into Tadcaster take the road for Boston Spa cross the Harrogate Road and on to Pool Bank etc. It can be murder if you get behind a tractor.

simong · Post by **simong** » Wed 24 Oct, 2012 11:06 pm

BIG N wrote: What's got me a little confused unless I've missed something of course is this - there's talk of the intended system operating in places over sections of existing heavy rail, how would this be powered ? Because I'm pretty sure theres no light rail system that operates at 25kv The units are dual system. In this case they will probably be dual electric although diesel-electric systems exist. There's going to be a pilot scheme on the Sheffield-Rotherham line in 2015.

jonleeds · Post by **jonleeds** » Thu 25 Oct, 2012 12:05 am

All this talk of more trains on the Harrogate line and then more planes from LBA is giving me a headache. I live in West Park right at the side of the ring road and next to the Harrogate line and directly below the flight path and I can see the planes touch down and take off from the southernmost end of the runway at the airport. So all this, if it happens will just contribute to the already massive amount of noise that goes on. Call me cynical but after the 'supertram' debarcle I just see this as another opportunity that Leeds City councillors will use to line their own pockets at the ratepayers expense with millions of pounds squandered on 'consultancy' fees that ultimately achieve nothing... Who are these consultants and why does it cost millions of pounds to draft plans for schemes that never materialise? It must be a right 'little' earner for these crooks. There has been a massive amount of work going on the stretch of the Harrogate line that I can see. Daily, dozens of workers in hi-viz orange work wear have been working on the line for well over a year, and to say its a stretch of line that is essentially a branch line railway except the one intercity train to London that passes by on a morning / returning in the evening to Harrogate it seems they are preparing for bigger things.

Post by **cnosni** » Thu 25 Oct, 2012 12:39 am

raveydavey wrote: Johnny39 wrote: L-B is rather difficult to get to from York and further north-eastwards. True you don't have to go into the city of Leeds but there is no major road I can think of from the north-east of the county to the airport. Humberside and Doncaster are more accessible but don't have the same choice of destinations. I think it's accepted now that LBA is in the wrong place, but I guess we're stuck with it.IIRC, traffic heading down the A1 is directed off at Harrogate onto the A59 and then around the A658 to the south of the town and (eventually) up Pool bank - a fairly tortuous single carriageway route.Traffic from the York area either follows the same looping route, or comes via Collingham and Harewood on the equally indirect A659 to Pool bank - the York Airport bus follows that route and only just fits round some corners betwixt Harewood and Pool.I'm still not convinced by the planned "tram train" route. Other than the airport I'm unclear who will it serve. Do many people need to get to Guiseley from Horsforth (or vice versa) via public transport? Dave,its not so much about commuters but airline passengers and the airport,i dont think it is meant to serve anyone else,just them.

Post by **cnosni** » Thu 25 Oct, 2012 12:40 am

Keg wrote: Perhaps i am being old and boring but i do not see how the tram or trolleybus is going to solve the transport problems of the city.Will they share the same road space as cars?- if yes, then no benefit over a bus. If no then use that space as a guided bus route. These can then come off the guides and go "round the houses".Are these a real solution or a "nice to have" so it allows us to keep up with other cities.Building some more roads rather than cutting capacity on the current ones might helpThe underground idea is just a pipe dream, way too expensive.The rail link to LBA is a good idea, Horsforth across to either Guisley or Menston would be a good route. I live in Rawdon and there are plans to include a lot of the land around the area in the plan for possible housing development so if they want to build the line they need to get a move on.LBA is a conumdrum. It has its uses as a holiday airport and for some business flights but until it gets a regular US route(s) and some more long haul operators, it will be just that, a small local aiport.Even Heathrow does not charge for droppping off so why LBA's owners think they can charge it, god only knows. I just walk up the road and get somone to pick me up there. The supposed tram train link to the aiport isnt about solving the transport problems of the city,its about providing a hopefully decent rail link to LBA.Tram Trains can run on light rail,like supertram was supposed to be and also on heavy rail.like normal trains.The posts previous to this explain that the tram trains are supposed to run from Leeds City Station up the hArrogate railway line thenwith a spur at Horsforth (through already in situe ne wpoints) by a light rail link to the airport.The plan then would be to let the light rail link then run onto Guiseley where the tram can rejoin the heavy rail line (perhaps changing ends ) and then run on the heavy rail via Baildon and Dockfields Junction to Shipley and Bradford Fortser Square.If this can be attained then there is no reason why services from Skipton cannot go to the airport,and furthermore no reason why they could not do so from Harrogate (change ends in Horsforth and shunt through) and also from York,either via Starbeck or Leeds (which would be quicker)As ive said its all conjecture,but IF it goes ahead and IF LBA's master pland of providing more terminals and a longer runaway then perhaps the issue of flights to the US and long haul may one day come to pass(im not holding my breath)

Post by **cnosni** » Thu 25 Oct, 2012 12:46 am

jonleeds wrote: All this talk of more trains on the Harrogate line and then more planes from LBA is giving me a headache. I live in West Park right at the side of the ring road and next to the Harrogate line and directly below the flight path and I can see the planes touch down and take off from the southernmost end of the runway at the airport. So all this, if it happens will just contribute to the already massive amount of noise that goes on. Call me cynical but after the 'supertram' debarcle I just see this as another opportunity that Leeds City councillors will use to line their own pockets at the ratepayers expense with millions of pounds squandered on 'consultancy' fees that ultimately achieve nothing... Who are these consultants and why does it cost millions of pounds to draft plans for schemes that never materialise? It must be a right 'little' earner for these crooks. There has been a massive amount of work going on the stretch of the Harrogate line that I can see. Daily, dozens of workers in hi-viz orange work wear have been working on the line for well over a year, and to say its a stretch of line that is essentially a branch line railway except the one intercity train to London that passes by on a morning / returning in the evening to Harrogate it seems they are preparing for bigger things. I agree with you over the supertram debacle,i would be worried if the council could cope but it is actually the Leeds City region (with some Leeds Council members) who are behind this proposition.As i explaine din earlier posts the work that has been going on on the Harrogate line is some points and a shunt neck at Horsforth to allow trains from York to Horsforth, via Harrogate, to be able to turn back to York.They have also installed extra signals to enable more trains to run between Horsforth and Harrogate as the line cannot run anymore trains as it stands.The extra signals will really mean quicker journey times.There are noplans to run any extra inter city services between Harrogate and Leeds and KX.