Non-LCT Buses that ran into Leeds

majorhoundii · Post by **majorhoundii** » Tue 29 May, 2012 12:29 am

BLAKEY wrote: majorhoundii wrote: I don't know about this quality thing. I recall riding on West Riding buses in the sixties (the EHL and FHL Leyland PD3's) when you couldn't hear the engine for the rattling of the windows.There was also the (in the sixties and seventies) the very poorly maintained Yorkshire Woollen fleet. Indeed there was a little girl killed on a YWD bus, she fell through an unsecured floor access point and her hair went around the prop shaft. Distance lends enchantment as they say. With respect majorhoundii - the admittedly infuriating window rattling on the PD2s and others of those days was simply a question of minor items which could have been easily repaired or replaced. Those of us who are complaining nowadays are referring to hopelessly designed and inadequately constructed heaps which display serious structural deficiencies within days of entering service, if not before.I had two such ordeal rides yesterday. One was on a six year old single decker which was so unacceptable that it should not have been on the road. The homeward journey was on a virtually new double decker which, on smooth parts of the road, was just about able to behave, but on anything other than a smooth surface was already showing the beginnings of sides flapping and floors(complete with seats) beginning to jump.The position in the Industry is extremely serious !! But the notorious Wuflrunians more or less pushed the West Riding into the National Bus company and bankrupted Guy Motors.

Leodian · Post by **Leodian** » Tue 29 May, 2012 12:30 am

I very recently saw one of the FTR (purple slug) buses that had broken down on Boar Lane and had a very large breakdown vehicle just starting the process of attaching the bus to be towed away. It looked like it could be a difficult job.

LS1 · Post by **LS1** » Tue 29 May, 2012 9:14 am

I remember some of the old buses that I used to travel on when I was younger. Not sure what they were, but they were in the late 1980s and on the routes 2, 3, 12, 71 and 48. The 2,3, & 12 used the worst buses imaginable, smelly, old windows didn't fit, they leaked and often the windows fell out. The bell didn’t work, there was not disabled access, they were cold in the winter, the diesel fumes got into the bus itself and they had little or no suspension. I cant remember the other route buses too well, but I think that the new first bus' are faceless yes, and every city has the same livery they look a mess but the are a damn site more comfy than the buses of yesteryear. The are warm in winter, yes the rattle a lot but then again they are in constant use on terrible roads that are so bumpy they inevitably shake things loose. I'm too young to remember trams (by a long way) but have been on numerous heritage tramways and they were really not comfortable at all - I thought they were great as it was nostalgic etc. but I really cant help but think we are better off now in terms of comfort and reliability.

BLAKEY · Post by **BLAKEY** » Tue 29 May, 2012 9:43 am

[quotenick="majorhoundii"][quotenick="BLAKEY"] majorhoundii wrote: But the notorious Wuflrunians more or less pushed the West Riding into the National Bus company and bankrupted Guy Motors. Very true, but a totally different issue !! The Wulfrunian was a completely revolutionary experimental concept and only around 130 were produced before the two parties concerned had the guts to acknowledge their terrible error - albeit without the option to do much else. Despite this the Wulfrunian was a very brave try with some good features about it and, if finance had allowed, it could have achieved its aim of front engine reliability combined with one person operation. The similarly conceived Ailsa Volvo of later years was a magnificent vehicle which carried 79 seated passengers and had ample platform space around the smaller engine and the more normal offside staircase.

BLAKEY · Post by **BLAKEY** » Tue 29 May, 2012 9:57 am

LS1 wrote: The 2,3, & 12 used the worst buses imaginable, smelly, old windows didn't fit, they leaked and often the windows fell out. The bell didn’t work, there was not disabled access, they were cold in the winter, the diesel fumes got into the bus itself and they had little or no suspension. In some cases yes, but they weren't like that when they were brand new, and apart from certain very isolated incidents I don't remember windows "often falling out." The WYPTE's standard Atlanteans, earlier examples in particular, did have a problem wtih window mountings at first but these were later rectified. The Atlanteans also had conventional leaf springs which were not up to the job, especially when the number of permitted standing passengers was mysteriously and very foolishly increased from eight to as many as fifteen - most dangerous in my view.The successor to the Atlantean was the superb Leyland Olympian - in my own experience the most stable and well behaved double decker with no vices at all. On de-regulation in 1986 all those on lease were disposed of. I had the pleasure a few weeks ago in Blackpool to see Olympian number 5005 still in service at Thornton Clevelys - a mere twenty eight years old !!

majorhoundii · Post by **majorhoundii** » Tue 29 May, 2012 10:05 pm

[quotenick="BLAKEY"][quotenick="majorhoundii"] BLAKEY wrote: majorhoundii wrote: But the notorious Wuflrunians more or less pushed the West Riding into the National Bus company and bankrupted Guy Motors. Very true, but a totally different issue !! The Wulfrunian was a completely revolutionary experimental concept and only around 130 were produced before the two parties concerned had the guts to acknowledge their terrible error - albeit without the option to do much else. Despite this the Wulfrunian was a very brave try with some good features about it and, if finance had allowed, it could have achieved its aim of front engine reliability combined with one person operation. The similarly conceived Ailsa Volvo of later years was a magnificent vehicle which carried 79 seated passengers and had ample platform space around the smaller engine and the more normal offside staircase. And I believe based on taking a Wufrunian apart and improving upon it. Just what the Japanese did when McCarthy gave Komatsu the contract to refurbish the US Army's Cat machines!

BLAKEY · Post by **BLAKEY** » Thu 07 Jun, 2012 9:33 am

majorhoundii wrote: The similarly conceived Ailsa Volvo of later years was a magnificent vehicle which carried 79 seated passengers and had ample platform space around the smaller engine, and the more normal offside staircase. And I believe based on taking a Wufrunian apart and improving upon it. Just what the Japanese did when McCarthy gave Komatsu the contract to refurbish the US Army's Cat machines! Well, I never knew that - most interesting, and it certainly worked. I've always had a feeling though that the somewhat "blinkered" view that the Ailsa would have the same problems as the Wulfrunian held back its sales, which were far less than it deserved.

somme1916 · Post by **somme1916** » Thu 07 Jun, 2012 11:24 am

I'd be the first to admit that I'm not too up on bus types/manufacturers etc although I do recognise "a good 'un" when on board.I was a frequent visitor to Chas.H.Roe too when I worked for a major supplier to them so got to see a lot of the coach and chassis work.A few years ago when Black Prince ran out of Morley,we had an excellent Volvo single decker service which went like billy ho and had no trouble whatsoever negotiating the steepest hills.It just gobbled 'em up ! The drivers loved them and would always sing their praises compared to other makes/models.