Food for thought

[cnosni]

Leeds has always gone halfway,its never pushed itself.All the mentioned institutions are inded noteworthy (Opera North/Ballet etc) but only a small number of people on a small number of occasions will visit the City to see just the performances,and thats in the evening.Look at the Bradford Alhambra,top musicals,a cracking Christmas Panto etc.The St Georges Hall for gigs,what do we have?nothing to compare.And as for the Piano competition,well international it certainly is but the venue had anexpensive assesment carried out with a view to see what improvements were required to make it a world class concert venue.The result?Lots of reccomendations but no action by the council,in the end it turned out theyd commisioned the assessment in th HOPE that some private firm would wave a magic wand and would make it all happen,which of course it didnt.It is easy to be negative as we do have things to offer,but onloy we in Leeds know about them,we are a relatively anonymous large city.Ive put the argument forward before,a picture of a building.Id like to see how many people from outside of Leeds who could recognise a picture of the Town Hall,Civic Hall or even the Armouries.Very very few indeed.Yet show the same people a picture of the Tyne Bridge,The Sage,The Angel of the North,The Liver building or either of the Liverpool Cathedrals,or the Clifton Suspension Bridge,and even The Bull Ring or Selfridges in Birmingham and id be pretty sure that they would be able to place most of those pictures with the city concerned.Geordie is absolutely right,we need to have something iconic,something that people will look at and say "Leeds"Something that people will put themselves out of their way to come and see,and im not on about a John Lewis department store.Im thinking something like the Brick Man that Gormley had approached the fine Burghers of Leeds with,which of course the Philistines rejected.Of course Gormley is now internationally renowned artist and one of his immediately recognisable works has already been mentioned.Im going to put my neck out and say that the Arena will make a positive contribution to the profile of the city,im positive of that,but once again we are playing catch up.We have lost out on so much for so long because our glorious leaders have deemed necessary to just muddle along and make do.This attitude has resulted in a poor city experience in comparison to equally sized and even slightly smaller cities.Our wonderful (ahem) agreed (but not yet finalised) TBus is a poor mans dodgem car.The council have had to resort to accepting this poor substitute for a tram/train.BUT this is because of the poor attitude the city has had in getting funding for schemes like Supertram,Jeez even Croydon's got one!!You have to speculate to accumulate,a gamble to get a return.The government wont help the Leeds,and im not sure we have a council that wants to help themselves by taking a risk.I do take my hat off to the council for pushing the Arena,but i can only wonder that if the same determination and vision by councillors past had been applied then wed be on here moaning about all the southerners coming up here to stay,how they are cramming our tram to Temple Newsam,Harewood House,Kirkstall Abbey or how we couldnt get in at the Grand because the seats were all sold out for Bob Dylan to out of towners who are booking up all the hotel rooms and crowding the bars and restaurants and going around town photographing all the splendid architecture,street art and of course the blooming Brick Man.God help us,blooming visitors spending all this money and creating jobs,god help us.Rant over,(ive ranted again,oh no not again)

[Phill_dvsn]

Spot on Chris.I have to agree fully. Leeds isn't noteable for anything to outsiders. I think Leeds was so very wrong in not having Gormley's Brick Man built. Look at the Angel of the North as you say...Iconic. The land is still standing empty and derelict where it was supposed to have been built.What landmark buildings we have in Leeds is courtesy of the Victorians and Edwardians. It isn't anything put up in recent years. The market is of course well known, but now there is only a quarter of the great architecture still standing. 25 years after the fire we still have the 'shed' as the bottom half of the market. I remember them promising it was only a temporary measure in 1976. They knocked down Leeds last iconic building, the International pool. We now have a nice bit of waist land there. The land on Quarry hill. A tremendous site next to the bus station and rail line. It does have the Playhouse. But the rest of the massive site is taking up by bits and bobs of various little buildings. One can only imagine the great leasure, and cultural area that could have been. Clarence dock the ghost town because it has no decent transport links like Manchester/Sheffield. Why should people go there?I'm really struggling to think what else Leeds has. We have the armouries. But then every City has a museum. Bradford Media centre, of course your spoilt for choice in York. Leeds United... Not quite the stature of a big city club...Erm........        

[Si]

Phill_dvsn wrote: I think Leeds was so very wrong in not having Gormley's Brick Man built. Look at the Angel of the North as you say...Iconic. See my posts on the Brick Man, starting at the bottom of page 3 on the "What to spend our money on!" thread, Phill.Friends of mine down south know Leeds as the place that pinched the Armouries and Harvey Nicks! We all know there is loads of stuff to see here, but an iconic image would create the interest for others to look closer. What better way to show Leeds as the true "Gateway to the North" than a Gormley statue twice as high as the Angel of the North? Such a missed opportunity...especially as Manchester has recently been making noises into having the Brick Man built there...(presumably with two brick fingers raised in the direction of the Pennines!)Gateshead, a far smaller and less important place than Leeds has become extremely well-known around the country purely because of the Angel. I used to live there, and can't think of any other reason to visit the place, except as a way to get to Newcastle! PS OK, there's the Sage and the Baltic, but when I lived there one didn't exist and the other was a derelict shell...

[LS1]

I feel like I want to move somewhere else!

[Si]

LS1 wrote: I feel like I want to move somewhere else! I hear Gateshead's nice?

[Phill_dvsn]

Si wrote: LS1 wrote: I feel like I want to move somewhere else! I hear Gateshead's nice? That reminds me of the Auf Wiedersehen Pet episode where Barry is stranded, and lost in Gateshead at night Those with high blood presure best not watch this clip after 02.50 mins lolhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOS9SrfX5D4

[Si]

[Quote] Posted by Si. 13th Jan 2010: "I'm assuming the three designs "to choose from" are just illustrations or CGI? If not, what happens to the other two, and did we pay for them, too?When the North East wanted a "welcome to Gateshead" sign, they didn't piddle about with a gate with a head on it on a roundabout somewhere, and get the locals to vote for the nicest colour. No, they did it properly. Antony Gormley's Angel of the North might not be to everyone's taste, but it makes a bloody big statement, and has become an icon of the north east, and in the south, the north generally. If only we'd had the Brick Man.......instead we get some crossed gates for Cross Gates, and a big C for Chapeltown. Puts it in perspective, dunnit? If you can't do it properly, don't do it at all."I found this old post, too.(PS Just found out how to copy-and-paste from one thread to another - just practising!)             

[Trojan]

cnosni wrote: Id like to see how many people from outside of Leeds who could recognise a picture of the Town Hall,Civic Hall or even the Armouries.Very very few indeed.Yet show the same people a picture of the Tyne Bridge,The Sage,The Angel of the North,The Liver building or either of the Liverpool Cathedrals,or the Clifton Suspension Bridge,and even The Bull Ring or Selfridges in Birmingham I think you'r e right about Leeds. However, I think you're wrong about the Town Hall. It is a nationally iconic building. Whenever the news organisations want a picture to portray local government it is usually Leeds Town Hall that they use.I certainly had hope in the late nineties and early noughties that Leeds was moving up the scale of importance as a UK city. With LUFC in the Champions League, Harvey Nicks opening in Leeds, plus the city's status a financial centre second only to London. But TBH (and I'm not a soccer fan) the decline of LUFC coupled with the rececession seems to have crippled Leeds more than most.I suppose we should be thankful not to have a huge hole at the centre of our city.

[Phill_dvsn]

We haven't got one big hole in the centre like Bradford your right. But we have got lots of smaller ones dotted about the City instead The Bond street arcades, and Lumiere cancelled projects spring to mind.Leeds as a rule doesn't go for big holes. We like to knock things down and have rough surface temporary car parks on the (Y.E.P drawings/never got started/cancelled schemes) instead The 'temporary situation' is always promised by the council. In some cases it goes back 30 years or more. The Eastgate/market, and failed Criterion place/Queens hall areas spring to mind. The Leeds International pool has just joined them for good measure!                

[cnosni]

Trojan wrote: cnosni wrote: Id like to see how many people from outside of Leeds who could recognise a picture of the Town Hall,Civic Hall or even the Armouries.Very very few indeed.Yet show the same people a picture of the Tyne Bridge,The Sage,The Angel of the North,The Liver building or either of the Liverpool Cathedrals,or the Clifton Suspension Bridge,and even The Bull Ring or Selfridges in Birmingham I think you'r e right about Leeds. However, I think you're wrong about the Town Hall. It is a nationally iconic building. Whenever the news organisations want a picture to portray local government it is usually Leeds Town Hall that they use.I certainly had hope in the late nineties and early noughties that Leeds was moving up the scale of importance as a UK city. With LUFC in the Champions League, Harvey Nicks opening in Leeds, plus the city's status a financial centre second only to London. But TBH (and I'm not a soccer fan) the decline of LUFC coupled with the rececession seems to have crippled Leeds more than most.I suppose we should be thankful not to have a huge hole at the centre of our city. You are right,they use the pic of the Town Hall,but outsiders dont know its Leeds Town Hall,that the point i was trying to make.And we do have a huge hole in the centre,the Trinity Quarter,plus the "on hold" Eastgate Quarter,and MEPC development on Wellington Street/Whitehall Road.None of these developments will bring an iconic building to the city.Trinity Quarter if it goes ahead,was alrady experiencinf "efficiences" with its glass roof before the recession kiocked in.The Criterion Place and the two glass towers on Whitehall Road would have been impressive but they are gone.I cant believe that the Brick Man could end up in Manchester... oh hang on a minute,yes i can,theyve got imagination.