Barnbow

Post by **chameleon** » Wed 07 Jan, 2009 10:22 pm

Croggy wrote: I vaguely remember that there was a chippy at the bottom of Marshall Street, either that or a building next to it became a barbers and then a double glazing outfit I think, and is now part of the abbatoire offices.Slight correction, chameleon, as far as I know the garage at the bottom opposite Marshall St Motors is owned by a different person (or was). You may well be right Croggy - it was my assumption that they would be one and the same (many a fall has been had from so doing!), never struck me that the area would support two in such close proximity. I know the chap who owns the one on the left, I'll enquire in due course.

thetrot · Post by **thetrot** » Sun 08 Feb, 2009 10:58 pm

Hi there all. I found this thread fascinating and it prompted me to do a little digging and now I can contribute in a small way in this debate about Barnbow and the proposed bypass. Firstly, on http://www.barwickinelmethistoricalsoci ... /4746.html I found the old map and made a layer in google, the kmz file is below. There is a clearer map on the wall in Crossgates library, but I am yet to find the source of the map, but beggers can't be choosers. What is really interesting is just how many of the buildings locations are very clear in google earth. As a point of interest I have shown room 42 where the Barnbow lassies were killed and the kmz is below.I then found the councils site where they report on their 'community opinion seeking' exercise and the council leaders reports at http://www.leeds.gov.uk/page.aspx?pagei ... 14003E2FAA All very interesting reading and I made a layer from the map in 'newsletter 3' and it shows conclusively that the if the road is built it will run through the eastern end of the Barnbow site. I have attached the kmz to this post which shows this.I also found a document which suggested that English Heritage were considering scheduling the Barnbow site, though I am yet to receive a reply from them so I don't know what the decision was. The relevant document is at http://csweb.bournemouth.ac.uk/aip/gaz2 ... pdfFinally, a few tit-bits are in Hansard around the period. A couple of men arrested for trade union activity in 1916 on the site and then the differential treatment for Colonel Gascoine who was compensated handsomely for the use of his land, which he subsequently parceled up and sold and one Barnbow Lassie, horribly injured, who could not even get the money to be treated at the infirmary in 1921. Search term 'Barnbow' at http://hansard.millbanksystems.comLove the threads and all you wonderful people that contribute to it, a real people history.

thetrot · Post by **thetrot** » Sun 08 Feb, 2009 11:14 pm

I had trouble adding the kmz's so I put them on the google earth community at http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/ubbthreads.p ... 202163this new fangled technology huh!!!

Post by **chameleon** » Mon 09 Feb, 2009 12:03 am

thetrot wrote: I had trouble adding the kmz's so I put them on the google earth community at http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/ubbthreads.p ... 202163this new fangled technology huh!!! There are three proposals for the bypass, the two major investment ones both take a new road from Brown Moor/Thorpe Park behind Pendas Way and along more or less the present Leeds Boundry to rejoin the existing road beyond Red Hall.The 'low investment offer simply seeks to widen the existing route where possible. I believe we've already posted the links to show these; using the lintk above from our new friend to the LCC site, look then for the downloads of the Phase 3 Newsletter to see them all. I'm sure to get a good view 9as are otherson here) - 150m from my back door!

thetrot · Post by **thetrot** » Mon 09 Feb, 2009 12:25 am

hey there, thanks for he kind hello. I agree, there are three proposals, but a scan of the executive report shows what the council would like to do, and as they would seek central government funding then I guess they will pursue the 'heavy investment' route. Also, the development of Vickers and Optares land into housing relies upon a bypass, so the council will be getting pressure from those businesses and those in Thorpe Park for quick roads to the airport. So I know what route my money is going on after this recession is over.

liits · Post by **liits** » Mon 09 Feb, 2009 3:12 am

With any luck, English Heritage will schedule the site and this will give it some protection.

Post by **chameleon** » Mon 09 Feb, 2009 8:28 pm

liits wrote: With any luck, English Heritage will schedule the site and this will give it some protection. Looking around - I doubt it! There are many instances being talked about here at the moment liits, were being listed is clearly worthless in preserving anything I'm afraid.As for the road, we said somewhere back in the threads that up until the Highways Agency abandoned it, the preferred plan was the high-cost take-it-through everything version. There's little doubt that this will not happen now the road is under the duristiction of the Local Council - the enactment of almost all of the current Urban Development Plan for outer East Leeds is driven by the provision of such a transport infrastructure. It wiil happen, so will the development along its entire length.There was some years ago to take the improvement through the Shadwell section of the A6120, complete with elevated road ways over junctions as I recall. Pressure from the residents seemed to prevail in that instance.Noticeably, there is little coming from the former political opponents to the road this time round.

thetrot · Post by **thetrot** » Mon 09 Feb, 2009 10:19 pm

A little question, has anybody got any idea what constituency the Barnbow site was in in 1916 and who the MP was?It wasn't in Leeds East, though the MP for Leeds East at the time, James O;Grady said of Barnbow in parliament on February 19, 1917, "It is clear that that terrible explosion, with its lamentable loss of life, occurred as a result of the inadequate railway facilities which exist in that particular place." http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/comm ... _HOC_328No MP mentioned Barnbow by name in the debate, and the Munitions minister said there has been no loss of life, contradicting O'Grady outright, but I can only find the MP for Pontifract raising the disaster (and blamming the lassies for the explosion) and no local MP contributing to the debate.

beenie · Post by **beenie** » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 9:14 am

hi i just found this site and this thread, ive tried to skim through all the messages. my brother, my father and my Grandad all worked at Barnbow/Vickers my Dad and Brother was there until it closed.I was talking to my Dad last night and he was telling me that there are many old stores/bunkers dotted around the area, all obviously underground qnd quite a distance apart in case one were bombed then the others wouldnt be effected, he also told me that theres a large room/cellar/factory/store room whatever under the main building, he said he only ever got to go down their once and its where they kept all the plans etc for all the machinery, he said it was so big that you could easily fitted at least 1000 people down there!!I didnt get to speak to him for long but i will ask him more when i next see him!!

liits · Post by **liits** » Thu 20 Aug, 2009 1:51 pm

Several of the buildings at Barnbow [the original factory, not the Vickers building] had basements. The main admin building or Central Personnel Records Office aka CPRO had a basement level some of it used as offices but mostly as storage. One of the stores buildings [No1 Store] had a large basement which had at some point been used as a shooting range for a works shooting club. The two large workshops [West & Middle Shops] had small basements at the eastern-most end of each building.Looking at the Ministry of Supply ground plans for the factory, all the buildings were of a standard design for example “Workshop – Large (Large Machine Shop)” Nos. 2. “Workshop – Large (Light Machine Shop)” Nos. 1. “Workshop – Medium (Ancillary Production)” Nos. 4. Dining Hall & Stage Area (800 Persons) etc, etc and this includes nine surface, brick built, air raid shelters. The factories were designed to be built very quickly and not with the intention that they should last as long as they did. It seems that all large MoS office buildings had a basement for secure storage [including a strong room fitted with a Chatwood Milner vault] but the plans do not show that they are strengthened to provide any kind of refuge. Nor do the standard plans show any form of underground air raid shelters so I can only guess that they were a local peculiarity.ROF Steeton comprised one large workshop [the same as Leeds’ West and Middle Shops] as did ROF Blackburn. Both were of exactly the same design as at Leeds but without the sub-surface accommodation.