Leeds trolleybus scheme delayed further

BLAKEY · Post by **BLAKEY** » Fri 06 Jul, 2012 10:46 pm

Johnny39 wrote: I don't know anything about trolley buses but weren't they forever causing hold-ups after coming off the overhead lines? With respect Johnny, and even though I am fiercely against this proposed Leeds farsical nonsense, trolleybuses in general are very reasonably free from troubles in operation and de- wirements quite rare so I don't think that paricular possibility would go against them. You may find it strange, from the stance I take on this particular issue, to hear that I've always been a great fan of traditional trolleybuses - its just that operators should NOT inaugurate them where the route pattern and the exisiting road systems won't accomodate them - the vehicles per se are "reet" as we say in Yorkshire, its just the barmy proposed method for introducing/operating them which is the bugbear here.

Caron · Post by **Caron** » Fri 06 Jul, 2012 11:08 pm

Excuse my ignorance please but will they be expensive to run?

Johnny39 · Post by **Johnny39** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 12:21 am

BLAKEY wrote: Johnny39 wrote: I don't know anything about trolley buses but weren't they forever causing hold-ups after coming off the overhead lines? With respect Johnny, and even though I am fiercely against this proposed Leeds farsical nonsense, trolleybuses in general are very reasonably free from troubles in operation and de- wirements quite rare so I don't think that paricular possibility would go against them. You may find it strange, from the stance I take on this particular issue, to hear that I've always been a great fan of traditional trolleybuses - its just that operators should NOT inaugurate them where the route pattern and the exisiting road systems won't accomodate them - the vehicles per se are "reet" as we say in Yorkshire, its just the barmy proposed method for introducing/operating them which is the bugbear here. Thanks for the info Blakey. I don't recall where my misinformation came from, it was just something that was stuck in my mind. Did t.b's ever run on Leeds roads in times past? I remember seeing them in Bradford and I think they were blue in colour but as usual I'm probably wrong.

BIG N · Post by **BIG N** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 2:31 am

Leodian wrote: That's one heck of a long bustrain in the artist's illustration Phill. I reckon that if we have to walk to the back if getting on at the front it will be time to get off just as we finally reach the back. With all the congestion these things will cause and the limited speed they will possibly be operating at you'll be getting off at the same stop you got on at Leodian lol

Post by **cnosni** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 2:46 am

Squatch_11 wrote: cnosni, you say"That will not happen here im afraid,just ask yourself that if you did/do commute to Leeds then would this trolley bus actually make you think about leaving your car at home or at a park and ride?"Assuming the infrastructure is the same (say park and ride facilities are built), would it really make a difference what vehicle took you into town, assuming the times weren't vastly different?Anyhow, what will be will be, I hope for the sake of the city these aren't the white elephants you think they will be, and let's see what other initiatives come in the future. Indeed it may not make that much of a diffrerence,but if that is the case then why not introduce a Park and Ride scheme using existing buses ,and save even more than the £300m saved on Supertram when comapred to Tbus/NGT.People will not switch to using Tbus and the reason is is that the buses use the same routes available to cars,and will travel at the same speed,if not actually slower in most cases.People are happy to use their cars because buses are pretty poor,just because the NGT will be powered by OHL is not enough to make commuters give up their cars,to do that you must offer them something that will offer a fast and reliable mode of mass transport.Im not sure about the latter,but the former is certainly not something NGT/Tbus can offer.We need to get commuters and shoppers out of their cars,we need to do this by offering a viable and enhanced alternative,Tbus is not an alternative im afraid.It is easy to dismiss peoples remarks about the scheme as being negative,and that we should somehow be grateful for what we have eventually been given but i am an advocate of public transport,and i can see the urgent need to have a quality scheme in place,yet what we have here is nothing more than a show pony,and one ,quite frankly,that wont win any prizes.Just to put something into context,the Kings Cross refurb was budgeted at £485m,and cost £516m.We get £200m for a whole city's supposed 21st century transport infrasructure.

Post by **cnosni** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 2:46 am

Cardiarms wrote: It's a bus with unneccesary infrastructure. Missed this message.Simple,but true.

Post by **cnosni** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 2:48 am

WiggyDiggy wrote: Viable alternative?CyclingHow about more cycling infrastructure. Its often floated by people who don't cycle that they choose not to for safety reasons.LCC has introduced various routes which in reality are nothing more than a cobbled together section of various back street and off the beaten track routes.What we should be doing is building, along the 3/4 major arteries into leeds, segregated cycling lanes to offer direct and safe routes in and out of the city. I took a tour of some of Leeds worst junctions for cyclists last night and its not surprise why more people don't cycle. The facilities that have been placed at various points simply don't make sense and dont join together in any sensible manner.As an example take this route:From the YEP building running against the flow of traffic up Wellington Road there is a shared footpath for cyclist/pedestrians. So far so good perhaps but after barely a mile it ends at Armley Road. If you wish to proceed pass the gyratory then you cycle up Armley Road, join Canal Street and then enjoy fighting your way across upto 4 lanes of traffic.Who mapped out that route, why has the money spent in creating that been wasted in such a way.So, that is my alternative, take a fraction of the 100's of millions that this scheme needs and give Leeds the Cycling infrastructure it needs. A noble cause indeed,but no matter what,you wont get me on a bike at 3 in the morning in December

Post by **cnosni** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 2:54 am

Phill_dvsn wrote: raveydavey wrote: Just a thought, looking at the pic you've posted on the trolley bus (and others elsewhere online) - how tall are the wires? Would a double decker bus fit safely under them (or for that matter a decent height truck)? A lot look low enough for a bus or truck to foul in my opinion, all except the old archive trolleys that were double decksThey'll certainly hit the one in Leeds if this is anything to go by What were they smoking when they came up with that picture?How can you have 3 vehicles with 2 articulations which is not on a guided rail?

Brunel · Post by **Brunel** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 3:09 am

ON YA TROLLEYREVEALED: The Secret Leeds next generation trolley bus.

raveydavey · Post by **raveydavey** » Sat 07 Jul, 2012 9:04 am

Brunel wrote: ON YA TROLLEYREVEALED: The Secret Leeds next generation trolley bus. Brunel, simply for finding and posting that pic you deserve a knighthood. The future has arrived...