Cockersdale watercourses and mills

[Si]

Yesterday, Jim, my brother (Glenny3363) and myself went for another explore down Cockersdale. After having a look at Farnley Fireclay en route, where we found the remains of a stone and brick lined watercourse (with sump), we parked at the Gas House Tavern, and headed down into Cockersdale itself. The track leads down the valley, starting at the Valley pub. On the valley floor, there's a rather fine (18th century?) derelict house. It still has it's stone roof and what look like original window frames, but the brick chimneys on either gable are leaning in at an alarming angle. Almost the entire upper half of the house, including the roof, is covered with what looks like Virginia Creeper, which is presumably hastening the building's demise.Anyone know anything about this place?To the left of the track, there is a man-made earthwork, shored up by a stone wall. Jim thinks it looks like a possible rail bed?Somewhere around here, was Upper Mill, but the area is much altered, so it's difficult to be precise.Once in the woods, on the path by the beck, it soon becomes clear that the area has been thoroughly altered from it's natural state. On the west bank, there is a whole series of mill leats, sometimes one-after-another. Some are more obvious than others, suggesting several mills whose working life spanned different times, perhaps?At the first access track (leading from the beck up to Tong Lane) there is a wide area of flattened land, with two badly decayed brick walls, and a fine pair of rusticated stone gate posts. The next leat leads to what was the Middle Mill, below Corn Mill Farm. The remains of this mill are more extensive. It is almost possible to work out it's floor-plan. Part of a wall stands atop a bank, with a lot of demollision rubble fallen below it. There appear to be two outflows from the leat, one turning at right angles to the mill, and the other following a straighter course. We couldn't decide which was the wheel pit.Another leat was found further down, probably Lower Mill.When we reached the Tong Lane/Roker Lane junction at the bottom of the dale, we turned right, and headed up the valley side, where we found the brick-capped air-shaft. Near the top of this hill, we turned left, following a fast-drying up stream, which lead us to Back Lane. Across the road, was a building and a set of stables called the Pump House. Not sure what it pumped!Thanks to Jim at this point, for pointing out the difference between a sleeper and a timber!On the way back down into the woods, we attempted to find the source of the red/orange coloured streams that dot the area. However, we were unsuccessful - another visit in the future will be arranged - and besides, it was hot and the pub was beckoning!So all-in-all, we found the sites of several confirmed, probable and possible mills - all in one narrow valley, and within approximately two miles, if that. I'll let Jim put these mill sites in the correct order for the record, and correct any mistakes I've made/bits I've missed.I'm awaiting pictures, and will post them up when ready.Cheers!JIM!? JIM!?        

[jim]

Please shout quieter Si, I haven't recovered from our exertions yet! We did have fun though, didn't we?I'll do my best with the various mills/leats and other points of interest. Starting at the Whitehall Road end, following our walk, my thoughts on the man-made walls and flat areas are that they look like the kind of thing used as loading areas for industrial railways, but there is no evidence to show that that was their purpose, and not far for them to go unless there was an incline in the trees somewhere. Probably needs more investigation and thought. Further down this side valley there are obviously man-made decorative ponds in configurations with buildings and with sudden changes in levels that seem to indicate a good candidate for conversion from an earlier mill site or two, and the 1852 OS shows extant ponds which would support the idea. The first site in the valley proper with it's decayed brick walls is exactly as Si desrcibes it, and is so "probable" as to be a candidate for promotion! Just past the hefty stone gate posts Si mentions is what appears to be very vestigial remains of another quite short leat system ending like the others at a wider plateau area followed by a drop to the beck, but with no sign of stone or brick work. The fall available is less than any of the others, but that is no disqualification and I feel safe in regarding the site as "probable", though with somewhat less certainty than the one before.There is no mistaking the next system along. On the previous visit Tilly took a couple of photos of the well water-filled leat, and I was surprised on this occasion to find it completely dry! Tilly and I were so taken with this find that we didn't search below the brow of the leat and completely missed much remaining masonry in situ. Hopefully the photos will add to these narratives.Each system leads directly to another, the next leat uptake following every system end. So with the next and last "cert". An unmistakable leat leading to more masonry and on of the outfalls appearing between hefty parallel walls, though with nothing to show whether wheelpit or bywash. Here too Tilly and I had missed things, and Si and bro spent some time ranging round the area turning up new structural finds. Further along there are no remains at all, but both the 1893 1:2500 and 1894 1:10560 OS maps show apparent man-made earthworks in exactly the right place for another system reaching Tong Lane and I feel there is a possibility that there was another leat/mill system here as well, but in the absence of further evidence that must remain conjectural. The earthworks have apparently been "ploughed out".So. lots of interest, further investigations could follow, hopefully Si will correct any errors on my part-----apart from the time I managed to lead us round in circles, realised when we passed a signpost at the top of the wood, whilst looking for iron-water streams, for the second time!

[Si]

No...no errors Jim. Just as I remember it.At Middle Mill, amongst the stone debris was some brickwork. One loose brick was completely plain - no "frog." Anyone any ideas how old it might be?Thanks.PS Still awaiting photos.....IAN!!!?

[Si]

Si wrote: If there are middle and lower mills, what happened to Upper Mill I wonder? PS Parksider - you're gonna love this - the farm just east of Sykes/Nan Whins Wood is called Park Side Farm! We have now found the approximate site of Upper Mill just below Cockersdale village, using old maps and shoe-leather.Browsing on the net, I've found an 1881 Census return for the Farnley township, and it gives the names of people living and working at Upper Mill, Park Side Farm, Farnley Corn Mill (Middle Mill?) and Farnley Mill (Lower Mill?), as well as other addresses in the area, including the Beulah pub.www.calverley.info/farn_cen_1881_4.htm PS Still waiting for photos Ian! IAN!!!         

[history]

tilly wrote: I know of three mills on the side of the beck the first one was on your right just before Roker Lane this was a scrap yard when i moved into Pudsey thirty years ago.The next one was on Roker Lane new apartments now built on the site the next one was in the valley at the bottom of Hare Lane.Looking at the history of Fulneck School they had a dye house at the side of the beck this would be were Keeper Lane crosses the beck.As you say there was quite a lot going on in this area the reason there are not many trees on one side is a lot of timber was taken from here to make props for the trenches in the First World War this is what i have read when looking at the history of Fulneck.I look forward to reading more. Ps Looking at the picture of the Old Mill the path is a lot lower than the beck has you know water always finds the lowest point what is the story here? Hi everyone, i have just been sent this thread via another one and in reading your conversation i would like to help if i can, i have read something about the water course and corn mill farm, my friend has cornmill farm and i live opposite on whitehall road, the land i own was mined for iron stone from apx 1850 onward, i hope this is of help to youcheers history

[history]

The Parksider wrote: jim wrote: Thanks Parksider,looks like I've got what I was looking for,don't know the 1854 map,could you tell me what scale it is and if it is accessible or available to buy?As to the "Forge",it is the local name for Farnley Ironworks,reconstituted as Farnley Fireclay in the 1920s,when the bottom had finally fallen out of wrought iron as a large use commodity.I spent my pre-teen years in love with the place and eagerly seek maps and references of it.Got one or two good ones,but still after more.I don't suppose the 1854 OS you mention goes as far as three-quarters to one-and-a-quarter miles due east does it?If it does,it may show early workings on the site.Then again it is possible that the date is just too early.The area is now host to the Whitehall Trading Estate,and some of the buildings are from the period I am interested in,but the context is mostly lost.My thanks for your helpful input,pity it explodes my iron-connection theories!     Jim,Your iron theories are not exploded at all. That in 1854 none of the mills were foundries isn't proof that iron making did not happen in the valley. The local populace needed iron, the coal was there in abundance, iron was probably associated with the seams and so it is very likely an early iron foundry is somewhere. Later as experts say Bradford (Low Moor) will have supplied local wrought iron needs, but iron founding is highly likely.The Mills in existence in 1854 (and 1754 could have been completely different) were..................1. Middle Mill (corn) at the bottom of mill lane2. Lower Mil (woolen) in nan whins wood3. Union bridge Mill (wool) on union bridge Roker Lane4. Farnley Mill (Wool) on the bridge troydale lane5. Hough Mill (corn) off pudsey roadMill races (goits) are in place at the latter two mills.Just a matter of getting to se the sites now. I love such walks but hate landowners and their getoffamoiland attitudes!Hopefully there'll be public footpaths remaining to them all. In reading your conversation i would love to help, there was a pit what was used to extract iron stone and in fact it was a 4 foot seem what was extracted and then shipped down to farnley iron compan (whitehall estate)...the pit belonged to farnley iron company and the workings began in the 1850s, my great grandfarther used to transport the material part way to the railway track on his horse and cart where it then continued down to what is now whitehall estate, ive owked on whitehall eastate for over23 yrs now and are located in what was the old pitt pony shedif you need any more help please feel free to ask, hope tihs has been a help to youcheers history

[chameleon]

History:I'd be interested to hear of anything you can offer about Sykes Farm/Wood and the jndigenous family in the area after whom it was named and Beulaugh House.

[The Parksider]

history wrote: In reading your conversation i would love to help, there was a pit what was used to extract iron stone and in fact it was a 4 foot seem what was extracted and then shipped down to farnley iron compan Thanks History - got a location for the mine??

[history]

The Parksider wrote: history wrote: In reading your conversation i would love to help, there was a pit what was used to extract iron stone and in fact it was a 4 foot seem what was extracted and then shipped down to farnley iron compan Thanks History - got a location for the mine?? No problem, it was up whitehall road past the woodcock, i own the land it was on.

[jim]

Following up the possible identification of the loading staithe/early railway in the above posts of 28/05/10 by Si and myself, I have come across further information - and, of course, more questions!Some time ago I acquired a copy of "Stone Blocks and Iron Rails" by Bertram Baxter. It is now a rare (and expensive) book on pre-steam railways, complementary to M.J.T Lewis's "Early Wooden Railways". The extensive gazetteer contains the following entry:- DRIGHLINGTON. Tramroad "worked by machinery" (power operated incline?) from staithe in Cockersdale to Lower Collieries. No details. Opened: 1814. Traffic: coal.I tried to identify Lower Collieries by a post in the "Coal Mines in Leeds" thread on S.L. but without success. The best I can do is to put forward the nearest colliery which could conceivably have been rail connected to the Cockersdale site that might also fit the scanty details in the gazetteer entry. I have used the 1852 O.S. map (old-maps refs 422900, 429500) and various present day maps of the area. The 1852 map shows Whitehall Road in its present day configuration, but the road was only constructed (as a turnpike trust, Act of 1826) in 1833. Prior to this date it is apparent that the road route past the site would have been via Old Lane/New Lane/Gildersome Lane and so to Low Moor Side Lane and Low Moor Side itself. Presumably the embankment over Cockersdale was a part of the Turnpike works, and the route out of Cockersdale to the south was originally at a lower level in the valley bottom, west of the present access which goes down a straight steep evenly graded road. It is my theory that this modern access was actually laid on the course of the power operated incline mentioned in the gazetteer entry.There would have been some sort of construction with a barrel and brake wheel at the incline top for the descending loaded wagons to haul the empty returning wagons up the hill on their way back to the colliery. The 1852 map shows a trackway/footpath or some such continuing the alignment of the possible incline southwards to connect with Old Lane. The tramroad/railway might then have followed Old Lane through Nethertown to the colliery site shown on the 1852 map, possibly being the "Lower Colliery" referred to in the gazetteer.Yes, lots of conjecture, but I don't see an alternative. All further sugestions, alternatives, information, and cries of "rubbish" welcome.In conclusion, provision of a staithe, incline, and rail access for coal indicate that there must have been (for the period) a serious level of industrial working on this site around 1800-1830. My guess would be that it was iron working, and that the mills further down Cockersdale (and the possibility of more in the immediate vicinity of the staithe) were connected with this industry.