Does anybody in Leeds(anywhere?)speak Welsh?

Trojan · Post by **Trojan** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 11:31 am

simong wrote: Trojan wrote: Perhaps we could start on Scots and Ulster Scots next?http://www.scotslanguage.com/books/view/2/ Scots really does bend the concept of language. Where Welsh is at least an identifiable language for all its modern transliterations, Scots has very few if any unique words. Languages do attract money and prestige though, which is why the Scottish Government has supported its adoption. Ken = know - they definitely use thatjy = letter j - they definitely use that toothole - equivalent of Yorkshire's "thoil" - justify is the nearest I can get. Forebye = even, as well asthat's enough Scots ed.

Trojan · Post by **Trojan** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 12:33 pm

Keg wrote: Good point Si! :-)But seriously, why do we go to the cost of translating into all these different languages.This isn't an anti imigration rant, far from it but i really do think that we need to stop all this stuff. Why do we go to the enormous cost of having a Royal Family who have no real function in our country apart from to look decorative?

Reginal Perrin · Post by **Reginal Perrin** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 1:44 pm

Trojan wrote: simong wrote: Trojan wrote: Perhaps we could start on Scots and Ulster Scots next?http://www.scotslanguage.com/books/view/2/ Scots really does bend the concept of language. Where Welsh is at least an identifiable language for all its modern transliterations, Scots has very few if any unique words. Languages do attract money and prestige though, which is why the Scottish Government has supported its adoption. Ken = know - they definitely use thatjy = letter j - they definitely use that toothole - equivalent of Yorkshire's "thoil" - justify is the nearest I can get. Forebye = even, as well asthat's enough Scots ed. the say "muwwyons and buwwyons" instad of "millions and billions" too.

simong · Post by **simong** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 4:34 pm

Trojan wrote: simong wrote: Trojan wrote: Perhaps we could start on Scots and Ulster Scots next?http://www.scotslanguage.com/books/view/2/ Scots really does bend the concept of language. Where Welsh is at least an identifiable language for all its modern transliterations, Scots has very few if any unique words. Languages do attract money and prestige though, which is why the Scottish Government has supported its adoption. Ken = know - they definitely use thatjy = letter j - they definitely use that toothole - equivalent of Yorkshire's "thoil" - justify is the nearest I can get. Forebye = even, as well asthat's enough Scots ed. A lot of colloquial Scots is descended from Scots or Irish Gaelic though. Scots was more or less invented to transliterate the Lowlands (Lallans) Scots dialect and see it in print. By that token, a broad Yorkshire dialect looks like a language when written down as it sounds, but I don't think there's any campaign to have it recognised as a language.It's about nationality - the Scots wanted a language as an affirmation of nationhood in the same way as Welsh, and Gaelic in the Highlands.

Trojan · Post by **Trojan** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 6:27 pm

simong wrote: Trojan wrote: simong wrote: Trojan wrote: Perhaps we could start on Scots and Ulster Scots next?http://www.scotslanguage.com/books/view/2/ Scots really does bend the concept of language. Where Welsh is at least an identifiable language for all its modern transliterations, Scots has very few if any unique words. Languages do attract money and prestige though, which is why the Scottish Government has supported its adoption. Ken = know - they definitely use thatjy = letter j - they definitely use that toothole - equivalent of Yorkshire's "thoil" - justify is the nearest I can get. Forebye = even, as well asthat's enough Scots ed. A lot of colloquial Scots is descended from Scots or Irish Gaelic though. Scots was more or less invented to transliterate the Lowlands (Lallans) Scots dialect and see it in print. By that token, a broad Yorkshire dialect looks like a language when written down as it sounds, but I don't think there's any campaign to have it recognised as a language.It's about nationality - the Scots wanted a language as an affirmation of nationhood in the same way as Welsh, and Gaelic in the Highlands. A language is a dialect with an army. English received pronunication is just as much a dialect (South Eastern/South Midlands) as Geordie, Yorkshire, or Scots for that matter.

blackprince · Post by **blackprince** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 6:44 pm

Keg wrote: IMHO all official docs should be in english and english only... Leeds local government obviously don't agree with you See thishttp://www.leeds.gov.uk/lastingmoment/Gallery. ... 8Curiously Welsh , German Spanish , Italian , Portugese are not listed.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 8:29 pm

<<A language is a dialect with an army. English received pronunication is just as much a dialect (South Eastern/South Midlands) as Geordie, Yorkshire, or Scots for that matter. >>But that's not true is it as Received Pronuciation (RP)is no more the dialect of the South East/South Midlands than anywhere else.It was the language of the Court (and that was obviously based in London) and back in early medeival times the language of the South Midlands nobility assumed its position of preeminence amongst the ruling class but the vast majority of people in the South East no more speak/have ever spoken RP than they do in Yorkshire, Birmingham, West Country or anywhere else.And equally upper middle class/the aristocracy (ie those who had invariably been to public school) spoke RP wherever in England they came from.But yes trying to make out Scots to be anything more than a dialect of English is really pushing it - Geordie (ironically really when the Angles of the North East gave their name to both our country England (Ang-land) and language and Bede from that area was the first major figure back in the 7th century to write of the English as a nation) is arguably the nearest English accent as regards the amount of dialect words/constructions still used on an everyday basis but no Geordies try to pretend its a separate language .

Trojan · Post by **Trojan** » Fri 18 Dec, 2009 11:42 pm

[quotenick="Catweazle"And equally upper middle class/the aristocracy (ie those who had invariably been to public school) spoke RP wherever in England they came from.Because that was the way they were required to speak to fit in. I went to tech with a lad who spoke the broadest Yorkshire - a year in the navy based at Devonport completely wiped out his Yorkshire twang.

Uno Hoo · Post by **Uno Hoo** » Sat 19 Dec, 2009 12:08 am

Trojan wrote: Keg wrote: Good point Si! :-)But seriously, why do we go to the cost of translating into all these different languages.This isn't an anti imigration rant, far from it but i really do think that we need to stop all this stuff. Why do we go to the enormous cost of having a Royal Family who have no real function in our country apart from to look decorative? Someone has to legitimise the class system, Trojan. I don't think any of the Royals speak Welsh, even Wing Nut, who's Prince of it, if he can remember that among all his other daft titles.

Keg · Post by **Keg** » Sat 19 Dec, 2009 1:58 am

Give me the royals any day over a house full of bent MPs and the chav brigade.In fairness a lot of what the royal family bring is unmeasurable, yes there are a few minor royals that are hangers on but the main family bring a lot of tourism in.Most of our current communist sorry New Labour goverment despise the Royal family yet immediatley adopt the airs and graces as soon as they gain power. I dislike gormless Gordon in many ways but at least he hasn't taken on the airs that the Wicked Witch and His Tonniness did/still do.