Golden Fleece Inn

Explore your roots & tell us your family's history!
Mangrove
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Post by Mangrove »

Many thanks Si and the others. The pictures and maps are a great help and give me something special to work with when I'm doing my bit on the family history, rather than just present a family tree, I can give them a visual perspective on the area, then & now, and they make my pilgrimage to Leeds in the summer that much simpler.It's past the witching hour here.... and so to bed, per chance to dream.... of forebears serving porters of liquer to the residents of what appears to be a central part of Leeds... at the time.Cheers

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liits
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Post by liits »

1851 Town Plan on 2009 Google Earth.

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liits
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Post by liits »

Mangrove wrote: HelloForgive me not taking time to explore & understand the forum thing as I should but I think from the brief look I've had, someone may be able to send me in the right direction. I am putting together a family history presentation for my father (87) and have found out from British Newspapaer Archives and ancestry.com that my great (4 times) grand father lived in or owned the Golden Fleece in Kirkgate in the late 1700's. David Kirkman. His grandson emigrated to South Australia in 1858 making me a 5th generation Aussie. Mangrove Was David Kirkman your 4 X Great Grandfather?The 1834 Baines & Newsome Directory lists [at the Fleece] a Thomas Kirkman as the licensee. This is followed in 1839 [as the Golden Fleece] by Martha Kirkman. This is the only occasion that I can find the premises being recorded as the Golden Fleece and my well be an error.The pub isn't recorded in the White's 1842 Directory, leastways, not that I can find, but by 1845, the Kirkmans have gone and been replaced by William Hargreaves.        

Si
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Post by Si »

liits wrote: 1851 Town Plan on 2009 Google Earth. Thanks, Liits. That's brilliant. There's so much change, you must have struggled to find several reference points to make the overlay.    

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liits
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Post by liits »

and again with perspective..... [for the benefit of Mangrove - if you click on the red X above the message, you should get a large version of the picture [although it seems to take awhile ot load]]    
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Mangrove
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Post by Mangrove »

That's truly wonderful Liits. Many thanks your time & effort.I feel a bit of a plonker and I apologise if it has taken a while to kick my brain into action. You see, when I started researching a couple of months ago, I was focused on names more than places. So I went back to my copious notes from then and things are falling into place. It appears my forebears were keen publicans and inn keepers in Leeds. I have a couple more for you. Hopefully I can get a little info' on those also.As Liits asked about the family line... which prompted me to get my facts right..... David Kirkman    1783-1834 Timble Bridge, father JonathanAnother David K (possibly his grandfather) auctioned a yard near Timble Bridge (May 1790) in an area known as Garland's Fold. "A brewhouse, stables & other conveniences". He died in 1796 in Timble Bridge....aged 70!The 1783 David starts appearing in articles in 1817 being the owner of the White Swan, Market Place raising food for the poor with contributions from a Mr. Pounder of the Golden Fleece. His son Thomas Kirkman (1807-1843) starts appearing in articles in 1833 as the owner of the Fleece Inn in Cross Street (probably Ebenezer St?) one.. an interesting little article about a female opium eater's inquest being held at the Fleece. He obviously had a partnership with his brother in-law, owning the Bee Hive, Vicar Lane. That partnership was dissolved in 1838, a year after his sister's death. His early death meant his mother Martha took over running The Fleece. Martha died and the family sold up in 1850.Thomas' son David (1830-1871) is the one that came to OZ in 1858but appears to have had nothing to do with pubs. I'm that man's great great grandson.I hope that wasn't too confusing. So... I now have an interest in The White Swan in Market Place, and the Bee Hive in Vicar Lane.Sorry to throw you a 'curved ball'. Maybe there's a chance the White Swan or Bee Hive still exist? Somehow I doubt it.All for now
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liits
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Post by liits »

The Bee Hive lasted until 1899 and, like the Fleece, was another premises that didn't renew it's license due to being pulled down for street improvements.Was his brother in law ohn Waggit or William Robinson?

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Post by Si »

I think the nearest White Swan is the one that used to be on Call Lane (Mucky Duck,) there being (to my knowledge) no street called Market Place in Leeds anymore. Kirkgate Market is just off the top of this 1847 map, and the area above Cloth Hall Street is now the Corn Exchange.There is a thread devoted to this pub on here, where you can find pictures (the building still exists) and more information.    
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Si
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Post by Si »

The Bee Hive, Vicar Lane, on the 1847 map.Ebenezer Street runs along the north side of the Ebenezer Chapel.    
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Si
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Post by Si »

Garland's Fold on the same map.
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