Leeds in the 1870s

[Dakota]

Henry Wells was born on December 16, 1846 to William Wells and Betty Tetley.Thanks for all of the info - gives me a lot to start looking into - I had oral surgery yesterday so am a bit groggy from the pain pills, but it should clear up in a day or two and I'll remember what my name is.....

[Dakota]

Obviously the pain pills are working, I forget to mention that all of the relatives from the US make a trek to Fred's house, Sycamore Villa, where the present owners are very understanding of us. We have a photo of Henry and Sarah in front of the front door, so we all go there and ask permission to take our pictures there. They are a kind people and say "of course".

[grumpytramp]

Dakota wrote: Henry Wells was born on December 16, 1846 to William Wells and Betty Tetley.Thanks for all of the info - gives me a lot to start looking into - I had oral surgery yesterday so am a bit groggy from the pain pills, but it should clear up in a day or two and I'll remember what my name is..... I feel your pain (or groggy-ness)I was curious to see Henry's census data (and thanks to Ancestry I was able to see a few of the collated Wells family trees). My curiosity is that I am aware of one Joshua Wells, born in approximately 1828/29 in Hipperholme (Hipperholme is located 7 or 8 miles to the south west of Bowling). As far as I can ascertain in the 1841 census they were the only Wells family in the civil parish of Hipperholme Cum Brighouse. In the 1851 census there are more Wells in the parish but they appear to be the offspring of Joshua's father Jonas and his mother Hannah. Interestingly and here is the begining of the link Jonas Wells was born in approximately 1799 in Bowling. It would be a very good chance that he will tie into your own family tree; though at the moment I cannot spot that link (is Jonas perhaps Joshua or John?).Why my interest in Joshua Wells born 1828/29 in Hipperholme?Well in actual fact the Royal Commission Report on the Employment of Children in Mines 1842. In response to growing concerns about the employment of children, a series of Royal Commisions had been established in the 1830-1840’s to investigate working conditions in factories and mills. Rapidly it became clear, to increasing disquiet, the level of child labour employed in collieries and mines. In response the Government established a Royal Commission of Inquiry into Children’s Employment. Inspectors were dispatched to examine conditions in the coal fields of Britain, taking evidence from mine owners, the medical profession and men, women and children who worked in the mines. It was with almost universal condemnation that greeted publication of their report in 1842, when a shocked nation discovered the truth of employing children in the mines; particularly the appalling and deprived conditions that children as young as five had to endure. As a consequence The Mines and Collieries Bill was hastily passed by Parliament in 1842. The Act prohibited all underground work for women and girls, and for boys under 10.Samuel S. Scriven and William Raynor Wood were charged with gathering evidence in West Yorkshire which they under took with great diligence. Scriven seems to have concentrated on the coal and iron mines to the west of Bradford and Wood the coal and iron mines of SE Bradford and Leeds. The evidence they gathered was very detailed including reports of the inspection of workings, interviews with child colliers and with coal owners.Amongst the interviews reported to parliament in 1842 was an interview by Scriven with one Joswell Wells aged 13 (therefore with an estimated birth date of 1829) employed, curiously at Mr Well’s Colliery at Norwood Green, Hipperholme-cum-Brighouse As there appears to be only one Wells family in the parish of Hipperholme-cum-Brighouse in 1841, with a son called Joshua born in approximately 1829 that Joswell and Joshua are one and the same.Regardless, if Joswell Wells is not a direct relative, his testimony accurately describes the misery, squalor and exploitation that the Wells and Coultas family must have experienced in the 1840-60’s. Scriven transcribed the word of the thirteen year old Joswell in his report Quote: I have worked six years down here. I don’t hurry about twenty yards now but I have been a deal further. I have gone ten score yards afore now. I come down at seven in the morning and go up at six and after sometimes. I have stopped sometimes but not so oft, until eight. I have stopped so long because we could not get the colliers to come out, I can’t tell the reason why except that they were behind their work. I come down every day and if they should not be here, I get coals and clear the muck. I am paid by the week, 6s. and must do work. I take half a day sometimes. I went to day school when I was a little ‘un I now got to Sunday School. I can read but can’t write. Another thirteen year, John Bell described his own life at the same pit Quote: I am a thruster for John Farrer and have been employed almost six years in different pits. We have no girls with us. There are five lads, the youngest is going in eleven. The eldest is myself. We all come to work about the same time, at seven or eight in the morning, sometimes at six or before, ‘tis just a leets [happens]. We get our breakfasts afore we come down and out dinners down here at twelve o’clock. We have meat, a cake or butter and cake, nothing to drink until we go up at six o’clock, sometimes after. We have stopped until eight o’clock but I can’t tell you what that was for. We can’t get them as we hurry for to come out out. We all think we work too many hours a day. We should like to get out ‘o pit after eight hours if we could. We think that eight hours is enough for us. They lake some odd times and when they lake we do not but they make us much out the bottom and get coals what we can and what we can get we hurry. If they lake one day, the longer they work the next and make us make it up. We don’t think that is fair and we tell them so.They laugh at us for that and tell us to be sharp. If we don’t, they hit us with the handles of their picks and throw coals at us. I have been knocked down many times at the Low Moor Company’s pits where I worked before. I never went to day school but I go to Sunday School. I can read but I never tried to write. If there was a school in the evening, I should go to learn, I read at home now at nights. I read the Testament with father, I have not a Bible. Father is working at Low Moor Foundry. Mr George Emmet the coal master at the pit (essentially colliery owner/contractor) in interview with Scriven reports: Quote: He states that he has been a coal master four years and has now three pits in work. He does not know how many boys work in either but he has no girls. He does not hire or pay the boys nor has he anything to do with them. He does not know what time they go to work in the morning or what time they come up. He does not know at what hours they get their food there. He is sure they have dinners of flour bread. The engine stops one hour but whether the boys take their dinners then he does not know. He knows nothing or about them. He has no girls in his pits and is certain that there are none nor does he think it proper to have them, because it is indecent and immoral. Quote: He knows nothing of their moral condition and does not know whether theyattend Sunday Schools or a place of worship. He knows what the men are, but he is not bound to tell, because he may please himself about that. When I come over I may find out myself if I can find them. He does not hold himself responsible for anything that occurs with regard to the boys. If one falls sick his collier looks after another without any reference to him. All he has to do is to pay the men for the coal they get. He has no damp therefore he has no occasions to provide his men with safety lamps. He looks after the gear and engine himself. He has no regulation with respect to the number of men or boys that come down or go up together but he takes care that the ropes are sufficiently strong to bear two persons. He has never met with an accident yet except a lad having a bit of a squeeze now and then which he does not call an accident. He does not know whether the nature of the work is calculated to deform the lads or not, I had better ask the doctor about that. He has no objection for his evidence to go before the Board. I would be very interested if you could tie Joswell Wells to your own Wells family history in and around Bowling. Wee Joswell Wells miserable existence as reported, along with hundreds of similar reports the length and breadth of the Kingdom, helped to establish the principals of responsibility of employers for their employees and set the very foundations of on which modern health and safety legislation has been established

[Dakota]

Barlick Girl and I shall do some more searching to see what we can find. I so appreciate this information - as Henry and James were both hurriers and it gives a good sense of their childhood - similar to those around them - and how tough it had to have been for them.

[dogduke]

Any update yet Dakota ?You must nearly have enough to get that book/movie on the starting blocks !

[cnosni]

grumpytramp wrote: Dakota wrote: Henry Wells was born on December 16, 1846 to William Wells and Betty Tetley.Thanks for all of the info - gives me a lot to start looking into - I had oral surgery yesterday so am a bit groggy from the pain pills, but it should clear up in a day or two and I'll remember what my name is..... I feel your pain (or groggy-ness)I was curious to see Henry's census data (and thanks to Ancestry I was able to see a few of the collated Wells family trees). My curiosity is that I am aware of one Joshua Wells, born in approximately 1828/29 in Hipperholme (Hipperholme is located 7 or 8 miles to the south west of Bowling). As far as I can ascertain in the 1841 census they were the only Wells family in the civil parish of Hipperholme Cum Brighouse. In the 1851 census there are more Wells in the parish but they appear to be the offspring of Joshua's father Jonas and his mother Hannah. Interestingly and here is the begining of the link Jonas Wells was born in approximately 1799 in Bowling. It would be a very good chance that he will tie into your own family tree; though at the moment I cannot spot that link (is Jonas perhaps Joshua or John?). OkayTwo Jonas Wells appesar in the 1851 census that are born in Bowling,one with a birth year estimated at 1784 and living in Bowling and then there is yours estimated at 1799 living in Hipperholme.A search of the IGI shows two possible baptisms for each of these Jonas. 1.Jonas Wells bap 18 JUN 1784 Bradford, Yorkshire, England son of Jonas Wells2. Jonas Wells bap 25/03/1792 son of Isaac and Mary Clayton.This same record shows that he married a Hannah Goodall in approx 1827 and that he died October 1851.The first record on IGI appears to be sourced from PR and is consistant with the 1851 census entry.The second appears to be a record submitted by a member/contributor,rather than a PR record.As such these records should not always be taken at face value.There is no independent and individual record to confirm the 1792 member submitted baptism and there is no record of a marriage to Hannah Goodall in or around 1827 to tie in with the member submission.It is quite possible that the dates are accurate but as there is no source for either of the dates mentioned then you would have to check the PR yourself.However if we do take it at face value,and look at 1792 Jonas' father Isaac then there is another IGI record for a marriage of an Isaac Wells and Mary Clayton 20/11/1776.Unfortunately this is also a member submission,rather than a PR record and so would require a check of the PR itself to confirm this.This marriage record gives an estimated year of birth for Isaac as 1751.This again is probably a guess as the only age shown in marriages at this time is either "of full age" or there is a note that the person or persons are below full age and are being married with permission of the parents.There is an IGI PR record of a baptism of an Isaac Wells at Bradford 26/11/1752,son of John Wells.There is also a complimentary member submission which also shows he is born in Bowling and his mother is a Frances Hall.The same record shows Isaac died around February 1824.Id be inclined to take these two complimentary records at face value,but would advise a check of the PR.There is a marriage on the IGI for a marriage of a John Wells and Frances Hall at Bradford 07/10/1742,but this is a member submission once again,not a PR record.This marriage record gives John Wells a birth year of 1717,which is probably once again based on the submitters tree ,guess and/or research.There are two baptisms on the IGI at Bradford for a John Wells,both are member submissions.The first is 7/05/1710,son of JonasThe second is 8/01/1719,son of John.Neither entries give an indication of which area of Bradford they are from.The marriage submission for the marriage of John Wells marrying Frances Hall states that the 1719 baptism is the correct John.I think the best thing to do would be to get a hold of the PR,sit down,and go through every instance of the surname in the PR,especially burials.Then build up a tree from scratch,working forward.If the submission are correct then the 1719 baptism would seem to be the best option,but given the fathers name Jonas in the 1710 option then this is also a valid option,but without checking the PR then you cannot be sure.But lets throw caution to the wind and look to Jonas Wells,father of John 1710.I cannot find a marriage of the Jonas Wells to be the father of John 1710.There is an IGI record ,member submission,of a Jonas Wells baptised Bradford 22/07/1683,son of a John Wells and Katherine Murgatroyd which would suit well for the Jonas,father of John,in 1710.There is a marriage 20/02/1683 for a John Wells and Katherine Murgatroyd at Bradford,this is once again a member submission.It is also possible that this Katherine Murgatroyd died before 1690 as there is a record of a John Wells marrying a Judith Holdsworth at Bradford 28/04/1690.The same entry also shows that John and Katherine had a daughter Jane in 1687.I can find no record on the IGI for a John Wells being baptised at Bradford to marry Katherine Murgatroyd.To go back to the Jonas Wells baptised 1784,son of Jonas he would appear to be the son of a Jonas Wells who also had a son John baptised 1777.This Jonas,father of Jonas 1784 and John 1777,does not appear to have been married in Bradford.There is a marriage 6/10/1760 at Halifax of a Jonas Wells and a Hannah Jowett.Its not a million miles away and the only IGI record of a Jonas Wells to be the one married at Halifax in 1760 is a Jonas Wells baptised Bradford 29/11/1734,son of a Joshua Wells.There is a baptism of a Joshua Wells at Bradford 03/03/1705 or 1706,son of Abraham.This Abraham would appear to have also had the following children1. MARTHA WELLS - International Genealogical Index Gender: Female Christening: 02 AUG 1696 Bradford, Yorkshire, England 2. JOHN WELLS - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 04 NOV 1694 Bradford, Yorkshire, England (possible father of John Wells 1719??) 3. ABRAHAM WELLS - International Genealogical Index Gender: Male Christening: 05 JAN 1700 Bradford, Yorkshire, England I cannot find a baptism or marriage at Bradford for an Abraham Wells to be the father of the above children,but there is an IGI PR record at Baildon for an Abraham Wells born 20 JAN 1667 Christening FEB 1667 son of John.I think you will like this.The John,father of Abraham born 1667 in Baildon also has two other children recorded in in the Baildon PR1.MARY WELLS - 28 DEC 1663 Baildon, Yorkshire, England 2. JONAS WELLS - 17 JUN 1658 Baildon, Yorkshire, England A search for a marriage of a John Wells to be father of Abraham born Baildon does not appear to exist in Baildon,and more to this the only examples of the surname Wells in Baildon is the three baptisms above.There is a marriage at Bradford 25/04/1625 of a Jonas Wells and Jane Godley,this is an IGI member submission,there is also an IGI record for this Jonas'burial at Bradford 16/03/1630.This burial submission shows that Jonas and Jane Godley had two children,Samuel born about 1628 and buried Bradford 04/03/1630,shown as being of Bowling and more importantlyJohn baptised 19/02/1626,of Bowling.So its possible that the Jonas Wells married at Bradford 1625 is the father of the John at Baildon who has children Mary,Abraham and JonasI think we can now tentatively tie all these people together.If you recall the marriage of John Wells and Katherine Murgatroyd in 1683,they had children Jonas 1683 and Jane 1687.I could find no baptism at Bradford to be the John Wells to marry a Katherine Murgatroyd.However,the year of marriage,1683,fits well with the birth year of the Jonas baptised 1658 in Baildon,brother of Abraham.Jonas and Jane are the names of the children of John Wells and Katherine Murgatroyd,same names as the persons married in Bradford 1625,JONAS Wells and JANE Godley.My theory is that Jonas Wells who married Jane Godley in 1625 are the grandparents of the 3 Baildon children through Jonas and Janes son John born 1626.It could be possible that at least two of the Baildon children.Abraham and Jonas, move to Bradford and have families there,but Baildon Jonas is recorded as "JON" in the PR and that this "JON"has been taken as being either short for Jonathan or just plain John by researchers.This Jonas/John married Katherine Murgatroyd and John/Jonas and ABraham then established contemporary families in Bowling,each of whoms descendants continued to use the same family forenames.Where this fits in with the other Wells in Dakotas tree ids not clear to me as i dont have full access to their trees        

[dogduke]

Good grief Chris - how long did that take you ?Truly a marathon !

[barlickgirl]

Cnosni,This is wonderful research, thanks so much. Dakota and I share the same Wells/Coultas ancestry and I do have a tree on Ancestry "Holdsworth family tree" which is public. Since Dakota is in the USA and I'm in Australia it is a long and laborious task for us to get parish records etc. The Wells tree we have is largely copied from someone on Ancestry especially past William Wells b.1807.The earliest I have is Abraham Wells b 1664. Then his son John b.1694, then his son John b.1717 who married Frances Hall. Isaac Wells we know a bit about as he was mentioned in the Cudworth book "the History of Bowling" as "the trusty agent" of Sir Francis Lindley Wood. Isaac married Mary Clayton. Then comes, their son John b.1787 who married Mary Armitage and then William. I am descended from his son James who died age 34 and ther doesn't seem to be a death certificate available for him. Dakota is descended from James brother, Henry.It seems highly likely that your fantastic research has uncovered another generation back for us. Thanks so very much for all this hard work and you have verified for us what was unsubstantiated in our tree.You are all so kind!barlickgirl

[tilly]

Hi cnosni I would like to say what a great job you have just done with that family tree. Above and beyond the call of duty, like one or two more on this forum a credit to the Secret Leeds Site Well done.

[cnosni]

dogduke wrote: Good grief Chris - how long did that take you ?Truly a marathon ! aahhjust a couple of spare minutes