Bye bye countryside

book · Post by **book** » Tue 05 Jun, 2012 10:20 pm

Perhaps a further great concern may be the increase in right turning traffic travelling west at The Old Red Lion and wishing to access the existing conurbation and its facilities including public transport. The assumption of the Developer's Planners is that the low-density traffic design of Grimes Dyke will encourage the new residents to use the pedsetrian/cycle routes being included instead of driving to these. Yes, of course they will.You couldn't make it up could you!

raveydavey · Post by **raveydavey** » Tue 05 Jun, 2012 10:45 pm

chameleon wrote: Davey, the same was said as a defence against the building of the A1/M1 link road and indeed the remainder of the improvements including the East Leeds bypass however, the reality is demonstrably quite the opposite with an imense quantity of 'local' as well as more general traffic using these rather than the tradtional routes. Based on this I suspect that the cross-route giving access to the motorways North and South and towards the network into Leeds centre will will attract a considerable following, particularly from a newer incoming population less ingrained with the more traditional routes.The proposed development (yet to be named) which includes the Grimes Dyke element includes the provision of a significant section of the long debated A6120 bypass. Its arrival has always officially been deemed essential as a forerunner to any significant development of the East Leeds Extension Corridor which was indentified of ccourse by the Council over 10 years ago as an area to be given over to the long term future development of the city.With regard to the access agreed by the Developers and the Council Highways department, it will be light controlled in the same way as the access to the large Killingbeck Hospital development is and that causes little if inconvenience and indeed helps to smooth the overaall traffic flow at peak times. Non the less, I share your concerns generally on that point and now it is a case of 'proof of the pudding' being the test once built.Perhaps a further great concern may be the increase in right turning traffic travelling west at The Old Red Lion and wishing to access the existing conurbation and its facilities including public transport. The assumption of the Developer's Planners is that the low-density traffic design of Grimes Dyke will encourage the new residents to use the pedsetrian/cycle routes being included instead of driving to these. Yes, of course they will. What the planning panel's statement does confirm, is the Council's continuing commitment and determination to see the full Crossgates - Seacroft bypass come to fruition. The developmentmental use of the land it will enclose is, as we have established, already determined and approved - all that is left is now to influence the structure, form and design this will take to endeavour getting the best possible result of the ineviitable in the eyes of the existing communities. With respect the traffic lights at the entrance to the Killingbeck development are a nightmare, often bringing both directions on York Road to a halt for several minutes to allow a single car out of the development. Quite often the car is turning left (towards Seacroft) so there is no reason at all to stop the inbound carriageway. Combined with the ridiculous siting of the bus stop immediately through the lights and in lane one, it's frequently one of the biggest hold ups on York Road.I do agree though that regardless of local opinion it's clear that the development, new road and much more are coming despite what the local population want.

Post by **chameleon** » Tue 05 Jun, 2012 11:19 pm

'With respect the traffic lights at the entrance to the Killingbeck development are a nightmare, often bringing both directions on York Road to a halt for several minutes to allow a single car out of the development. Quite often the car is turning left (towards Seacroft) so there is no reason at all to stop the inbound carriageway. Combined with the ridiculous siting of the bus stop immediately through the lights and in lane one, it's frequently one of the biggest hold ups on York Road.'quoteAn inescapable part of life is that different people will have a different take on any given situation and I think this is a case in point - where we each have oposing views about it!!When traffic control on York Road was introduced my fear of the seemingly endless sets of traffic lights from the Killingbeck site entrance through to the inner ring road was of an impeding nightmare. I have found though over time that whikst I do have to stop at one or more of these from time to time, I no longer join a queue at the Hospital to painfully stopstart every few yards for the entire then legthy journey into town rather the journey times are shortened, much higher average speeds and consequently I reach my destination (you know roughly where I think), far more quickly.I do agreee and have commented on the 'new' bus stop provided for (presumably) the new residents of the Killingbeck site who it seems are incapable of walking the additional 30 metres or so to the properly designed stop adjacent to ASDA! It beggers belief never mind common sense or traffic flow managementDid you attend either of the ID Planning consultation evenings in Nov/Feb for the developments? I thoiught I may bump into you at them.

somme1916 · Post by **somme1916** » Wed 06 Jun, 2012 12:03 am

book wrote: I suppose putting a rail link or tram system in the new suburb is out of the question. A word of warning to all those in that area, I live surrounded by new road networks and it has regenerated parts of South Leeds but destroyed tranquility. There aren't any "new" roads around Thorpe ???? some new streets on the new estates but that's all.These are all dead ends in any case.Does need some however-e.g. from"Heritage Village" direct to A61 Leeds/Wakefield Road.Most existing roads are now "rat runs" or feeder roads to all the new developments.I should know....I live around here and have for over 20 years.

raveydavey · Post by **raveydavey** » Wed 06 Jun, 2012 10:12 am

chameleon wrote: I do agreee and have commented on the 'new' bus stop provided for (presumably) the new residents of the Killingbeck site who it seems are incapable of walking the additional 30 metres or so to the properly designed stop adjacent to ASDA! It beggers belief never mind common sense or traffic flow managementDid you attend either of the ID Planning consultation evenings in Nov/Feb for the developments? I thoiught I may bump into you at them. No, sadly I didn't attend either meeting - the first I found out about after it had happened (I live on the "wrong" side of York Road to be affected, apparently) and the other was also fairly short notice (to me at least!) and clashed with other commitments.Sadly, the fact is that these houses are going to be built and the assertion of the developers that the impacts on the local road network will be minimal as they are encouraging public transport / bicycle use is simply laughable.I have a friend who lives on a similar sounding (albeit much smaller) development on the other side of Leeds where each home was given a garage for one car only and any other parking was similarly "limited" to encourage alternative forms of transport. It's a nightmare to get down his street now as most houses have two or more cars, many use the garage for storage rather than the car and there is no room for all these vehicles. And this despite having (yes, you've guessed it) an 'every 10 minutes' bus service within a 5 minute walk of his front door....sound familiar?

Cardiarms · Post by **Cardiarms** » Wed 06 Jun, 2012 11:22 am

On St Michael's Lane in Headingley there is permision to build a 40 bed space set of flats opposite the cricket ground, for 'students and young professionals'. There are 10 parking spaces, 3 reserved fpr disabled badge users. In the plan it says people wont need cars so they wont have them. i bet.

book · Post by **book** » Wed 06 Jun, 2012 8:53 pm

somme1916 wrote: book wrote: I suppose putting a rail link or tram system in the new suburb is out of the question. A word of warning to all those in that area, I live surrounded by new road networks and it has regenerated parts of South Leeds but destroyed tranquility. There aren't any "new" roads around Thorpe ???? some new streets on the new estates but that's all.These are all dead ends in any case.Does need some however-e.g. from"Heritage Village" direct to A61 Leeds/Wakefield Road.Most existing roads are now "rat runs" or feeder roads to all the new developments.I should know....I live around here and have for over 20 years. Maybe not so new then but the noise pollution in the area from the M62 and link roads onto the M1 are the ones I mean. The whole area is polluted with noise, Thorpe, Wrenthorpe, Ardsley.

somme1916 · Post by **somme1916** » Wed 06 Jun, 2012 9:00 pm

book wrote: somme1916 wrote: book wrote: I suppose putting a rail link or tram system in the new suburb is out of the question. A word of warning to all those in that area, I live surrounded by new road networks and it has regenerated parts of South Leeds but destroyed tranquility. There aren't any "new" roads around Thorpe ???? some new streets on the new estates but that's all.These are all dead ends in any case.Does need some however-e.g. from"Heritage Village" direct to A61 Leeds/Wakefield Road.Most existing roads are now "rat runs" or feeder roads to all the new developments.I should know....I live around here and have for over 20 years. Maybe not so new then but the noise pollution in the area from the M62 and link roads onto the M1 are the ones I mean. The whole area is polluted with noise, Thorpe, Wrenthorpe, Ardsley. Yes my mate,in that you are 100% correct.....we are but an enclave in an approaching onslaught ! Never been as noisy,as busy.

Post by **chameleon** » Tue 12 Jun, 2012 9:23 pm

raveydavey wrote: From this morning's YEP:http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/n ... Developers behind proposals to build 2,000 homes on the outskirts of Leeds have been warned “don’t even think about a planning application” until key road issues are sorted out.The warning came from the council’s east plans panel when the Persimmon Homes-led consortium made a pre-application presentation to councillors outlining the scheme.Described as one of the biggest residential developments to be considered by the council for many years, the consortium intends to build the homes in phases over the next eight years on greenfield land east of Whinmoor, between Wetherby Road and York Road north of Skeltons Lane.The site forms the northern part of a large swathe of land known as the east Leeds extension (ELE) which is earmarked for long-term development.But councillors consider that the building of a new route – the east Leeds orbital road (ELOR) – is critical to deal with the extra traffic that will be created by new homes.And they are worried that proposals are starting to come forward without any firm plans for the ELOR in place.The Persimmon-led consortium is proposing to build a section of the ELOR but work on that will not start until the later phases of its scheme.Coun John Procter (Con, Wetherby) said a whole range of infrastructure issues needed to be resolved ahead of any development, particularly the ELOR. He said: “So far answers have not been forthcoming. They need to be considered before the applicants even think about submitting a planning application.“There is a need for a comprehensive orbital road if you are are to develop in the east of Leeds.”He urged all developers with an interest in the ELE to work together to come up with a solution for the road. Jonathan Dunbavin, planning consultant representing the consortium, said planning policy did not require “the orbital road to be in situ from day one” but he recognised it was an important issue for panel members.The panel heard that in the earlier phases of the scheme a range of junction improvements and other highway measures were proposed.Whilst the apparent stance by the council is welcomed, as anyone who lives in the area / uses the surrounding roads knows the current infrastructure simply wouldn't be able to cope with an additional 2000 homes (potentially 4000+ cars), it is worrying that the developers seem to think otherwise - and developers have a long history of getting their own way, be it through biased traffic surveys or by forcing plans to the Government Planning Inspectorate if the council have the cheek to say no.The access to / from York Road in the dangerous dip are already set to cause chaos and to add to these without serious improvements is a massive concern. That said, will the planned ELOR impact on traffic in and out of the city including from any new development? Probably not as it is designed to take cross city traffic away from the current Outer Ring Road network (from Red Hall to Thorpe Park, if plans are to be believed). Surely most of the occupants of the planned homes will be going to work in Leeds city centre, so will use the existing York Road or Wetherby Road depending on which is most convenient from their new home? For anyone interested in the detailed nitty-gritty of the presentation, this is a link to it-http://democracy.leeds.gov.uk/mgConvert ... x?ID=67458

Post by **chameleon** » Thu 14 Jun, 2012 3:03 pm

After consulting with Raveydavey, these posts have been moved to here from his new thread which also deals with devlopment of the green belt in East Leeds to consolidate the information into one place.raveydaveyUserLocation: LeedsJoined on: 22-Mar-2007 20:29:07Posted: 1831 posts # Posted on: 12-Jun-2012 19:52:22. Edit | Quote There is an advertisement in todays YEP giving details of a consultation period regarding the expansion of Thorpe Park (just by the M1 at Austhorpe) which will include the construction of the "MLLR" (Manston Lane Link Road). This looks like it might form the future eastern end of the much talked about Outer Outer Ring Road, aka the East Leeds Relief Road which we've covered before. If it does I'd be concerned about the number of roundabouts contained within such a short distance - traffic hold up magnets at the best of times as any visitor to a new development or leisure park can tell you.Now whilst the expansion of the office park is hardly the most exciting thing to post about, it's interesting to note that as well as "a vibrant mix of shopping, leisure and cafe / restaurant facilities", there is a plan to create a new park between the expanded site and Austhorpe Lane - Green Park, a 113 acre public park.This is interesting, as I'm struggling to remember the last time a new park on this scale was created within the city. I'm hoping it will be a permanent addition for the benefit of the local area and not a cynical marketing ploy which will be left to wither before falling victim to a future expansion plan for the site. There is also no mention of what will happen to the cricket club on Austhorpe Lane as the proposed park appears to take in their site.Details on the website are currently fairly vague ahead of the consultation starting, but it promises that more details will appear online once the first presentations are given.http://www.thorpe-park-consultation.co.uk/Speaking the Truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act – George OrwellDo something amazing today: http://www.teafortwo.org.uk/squares.htmljan8User Location: Garforth, Leeds 25Joined on: 02-Apr-2007 21:17:56Posted: 61 posts # Posted on: 13-Jun-2012 09:35:28. Delete | Edit | Quote It was part of the original planning consent that Thorpe Park create a green park/sports area when the building approached a certain amount.There has been a lot of local public objections already to the proposals for the placement of the changing rooms, which were going to be over near Austhorpe Primary, on the remains of the old farm.As far as I am aware the cricket club will remain, but perhaps not in its present location. There are also supposed to be football and rugby pitches there, but what concerns me is that the fields there are ancient "ridge and furrow" and I thought that they would be protected.The Manston relief road is indeed part of the East Leeds bypass and I guess it probably needs to be in place to serve all the new housing that is being built on Manston Lane. Yorkshire born & bred raveydaveyUser Location: LeedsJoined on: 22-Mar-2007 20:29:07Posted: 1831 posts # Posted on: 13-Jun-2012 20:22:51. Delete | Edit | Quote I think this summer is going to be one to be out and about with the camera on the fringes of East Leeds capturing how it is now, for future reference when people don't believe that "all this used to be fields"....It's quite sad really, but these plans mark the beginning of the end for Scholes and Thorner as separate villages, distinct from the City of Leeds, possibly Barwick too as the infill from the Garforth direction seems to be gathering pace too. Speaking the Truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act – George OrwellDo something amazing today: http://www.teafortwo.org.uk/squares.htmlguitar manUser Location: LeedsJoined on: 24-May-2012 20:05:33Posted: 6 posts # Posted on: 13-Jun-2012 21:10:50. Delete | Edit | Quote For the past twenty years the residents of Pendas Fields estate have lived under the threat of "The East Leeds Outer Ring Road "the building of The Manston Link Road from Thorpe Park would be an excuse to futher extend it to join the existing ring road further on.It would spoil the area around Barnbow Woods forever.It seems that all these developers get there own way at the expense of the countryside chameleonAdministrator Location: LeedsJoined on: 29-Mar-2007 22:46:49Posted: 5063 posts # Posted on: 14-Jun-2012 13:56:54. Delete | Edit | Quote guitar man wrote: For the past twenty years the residents of Pendas Fields estate have lived under the threat of "The East Leeds Outer Ring Road "the building of The Manston Link Road from Thorpe Park would be an excuse to futher extend it to join the existing ring road further on.It would spoil the area around Barnbow Woods forever.It seems that all these developers get there own way at the expense of the countryside This was a Highways proposal and known about before Penda's Fields was built (started ~ 1982). After detrunking of thw A6120, the road became the responsibility of the Council and the proposal is key to their development plans as shown earlier in this thread.