Leeds trolleybus scheme delayed further

raveydavey · Post by **raveydavey** » Sun 28 Oct, 2012 6:00 pm

electricaldave wrote: The transport system is now perfectly borked in the middle, where is happens to be the place where everyone goes to, or leaves from.If you live anywhere on the South of Leeds, and work anywhere north of city square, getting in is fine, but try getting back the other way.Now try do the same by bicycle, don't make me laugh - you can get from South to North readily enough, but the other way?This is supposed to be a city that markets itself on cycle friendly. Hmmpph.If you live out toward Rothwell or beyond, the roads are a mess for all modes of transport, including public transport - but for cyclists those roads are a special problem - the dual roundabout just past Stourton are not at all funny. If you want to go East, the only option is something along the lines of York Road - try that on a bicycle if you dare. Stoney Rock lane is fun when juggling with buses, and school run traffic where absolutely nobody is actually paying any attention to where they are going and have no awareness of what is happening around them - with their earbouds and ipods busy erasing their minds of survival instincts whilst road crossing, and it gets alarming when the car drivers are doing the same.I am only glad I don't have to go anywhere near Roseville road/Roundhay road/Sheepscar, but these areas have long been a traffic disaster zone, it will take some imagination to make them worse but I am not underestimating the ability of the town planners.All we need now is someone to **** it all up more by putting trolley buses with reserved road space to connect places such as Middleton with the centre.Equal opportunities traffic standstill for all parts of Leeds, rich or poor.The best option for everyone is to live in Woodlesford and get the train in. If you think things are bad approaching the city from the south now, just wait and see what happens if these plans get the go ahead...http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... .htmlEvery back street, side road and cut through will be rammed to the gills, whilst the occasional Mercedes or Range Rover wafts into town down a deserted M621....

electricaldave · Post by **electricaldave** » Sun 28 Oct, 2012 7:05 pm

Road charging has been on the cards for 20 years that I am aware of, guess where much of the research has been done? Leeds University.If there is an information flow from the Leeds City planners to Leeds University regarding this research, the whole country will be gridlocked in a day.The cycle routes were designed only to ensure that cyclists cannot make progress, and every mass transit scheme has been underfunded and completely and utterly wrong - quite how reducing dual carriageways to single lane is supposed to allow better traffic management is beyond me, unless of course you deter traffic completely, then you have none left to manage.All that the major road schemes have done in Leeds is to demolish the heart of the city in exchange for congestions and pollution - and building more suburbs on high value land to produce high value housing to keep the money coming in is only likely to make the problem worse.The idea we all have to live thirty miles away from where we work is the entire reason we have all these problems, yet I see no real proposal to build affordable mass housing closer to town. Those horrible tower blocks were never the answer, but the wholesale demolition of housing, with no local replacement is really the root of why our roads are congested.What have we done with the land we cleared of housing? Looks to me like literally hole districts have been turned into motorway, junctions, shopping centres and car parks - whilst the population itself has to use to get to work, instead of living tolerably close to the main employment centres.

somme1916 · Post by **somme1916** » Sat 10 Nov, 2012 7:24 am

It's reported on the BBC website(east midlands),that Nottingham has begun laying tram lines as part of an 11mile(17km) extension to their existing tram network.This involves construction of 2 new lines at a cost of £570million and is expected to be running by late 2014 !It begs the questions why a city considerably smaller than Leeds is able to raise such a level of finance(when we struggled for many years for £250m),whilst also being able to commission such a large undertaking before our folleybus is even set to "launch" ?We'll still be untangling the wires by then !And this is an extension to an already successful scheme don't forget.Must we always settle for 2nd or 3rd best ? If so,why ? Nottingham....a city with foresight and AMBITION.

Phill_dvsn · Post by **Phill_dvsn** » Sat 10 Nov, 2012 8:34 am

somme1916 wrote: It begs the questions why a city considerably smaller than Leeds is able to raise such a level of finance(when we struggled for many years for £250m),whilst also being able to commission such a large undertaking before our folleybus is even set to "launch" ?We'll still be untangling the wires by then !Must we always settle for 2nd or 3rd best ? If so,why ? Indeed Somme.Nottingham manages to get double the amount of funding than Leeds for 500 million less people. Now that's what you call value for money....not!!According to this websitehttp://www.ukcities.co.uk/populations/Nottingham ranks as the 14th largest U.K city according to population. It's actually so small it ranks behind Wakefield would you believe. It's interesting to note just how many Cities below Leeds have supertrams or light rail systems already in place years ago. Of course the City list doesn't include Croydon who have a superb supertram too. .......................................Largest Cities in the UKThis is a list of the largest cities in the United Kingdom. London 7.2 MillionBirmingham 992000Leeds 720000 *Glasgow 560000Sheffield 512000Bradford 467000Edinburgh 450000Liverpool 440000Manchester 420000Bristol 380000Wakefield 316000Cardiff 310000Coventry 305000Nottingham 285000 *Leicester 280000Sunderland 280000Belfast 280000Newcastle upon Tyne 259000Brighton 248000Hull 240000Plymouth 240000Stoke-on-Trent 239000Wolverhampton 239000 L.C.C really annoy me

The Calls · Post by **The Calls** » Tue 13 Nov, 2012 1:04 am

Councillor John Procter has had a letter published in the YEP calling for a tram system, and for the trolleybus scheme to be scrapped:http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/n ... 1-5121735I believe he's the first councillor to publicly criticise the trolleybus scheme.

simong · Post by **simong** » Tue 13 Nov, 2012 1:53 pm

somme1916 wrote: It's reported on the BBC website(east midlands),that Nottingham has begun laying tram lines as part of an 11mile(17km) extension to their existing tram network.This involves construction of 2 new lines at a cost of £570million and is expected to be running by late 2014 !It begs the questions why a city considerably smaller than Leeds is able to raise such a level of finance(when we struggled for many years for £250m),whilst also being able to commission such a large undertaking before our folleybus is even set to "launch" ?We'll still be untangling the wires by then !And this is an extension to an already successful scheme don't forget.Must we always settle for 2nd or 3rd best ? If so,why ? Nottingham....a city with foresight and AMBITION. Again, the Nottingham tram network is based on old railway lines and the plan has been in place since the late 80s with very minimal new build required. If I remember correctly the most expensive component in the next stage is a flying junction off the current terminus above the railway station and some roadside running through the Meadows and Wilford. Also the city council retains a stake in the public transport network in the city where Leeds devolved all responsibility to Metro, who sold off services at the earliest opportunity.As for finance, follow the route of line 1 from the north and you'll see it runs through a lot of old pit villages and workings. A lot of the money came from European funds, the same ones that South Yorkshire used to get a lot from, and that Leeds never had access to. A better comparison in our case is Manchester, but Metrolink is also built on old train lines and the remains of the docks. There was a considerable uproar when the old Altrincham line was taken out of service to be replaced by the tram as it meant buses for a year or so, likewise with the line to Oldham. Look also at Edinburgh: it looks like the whole project is going to cost over a billion across the 30 year PFI scheme for a city half the size of Leeds, partially built on old or existing lines but with a large (and very disruptive) road running component across the city centre more in keeping with what would have to be done in Leeds. On the other hand central Edinburgh is a lot more residential than Leeds and its commuting problems are far worse than anything we have - the cost of living in the city means that its commuter belt is probably twice the size of Leeds' - I worked for BT up there for a while and had a colleague who came from Ayr daily, something like a 150 mile round trip.Starting a tram system from scratch would be stupidly expensive. The council doesn't seem to get that a trolleybus replacement is just a sop for First (and it really is just them) and I believe that as with the lack of night buses and the difficulty in starting that the Free City Bus had, there are vested interests, often to be found in black and white cars, that would also oppose a tram system that would be any use. But, something needs to be done that's actually useful and beyond bus corridors. Maybe a monorail would work...

Phill_dvsn · Post by **Phill_dvsn** » Wed 05 Dec, 2012 9:06 pm

Looks like the wonder spin and glossy artists impressions are getting a bit shabby now.http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/n ... -5195437It seems many people are clued up to Folly bus being exactly just that, lets hope this continues

Cardiarms · Post by **Cardiarms** » Wed 09 Jan, 2013 9:37 pm

Folley Bus drop in sessionsHeadingley, Headingley Parish Hall, Bloodworth Hall, St Michael's Road, LS6 3AW Thursday 10 January 2013 between 6.00pm and 8.00pmHyde Park/Woodhouse, City of Leeds School, Assembly Hall, Woodhouse Cliff, LS6 2LGTuesday 22 January 2013 between 5.30pm and 7.30pmhttp://www.ngtmetro.com/faqs/Howtogetinvolved.htmWrite and shout about this at every opportunity.

Leodian · Post by **Leodian** » Wed 09 Jan, 2013 11:11 pm

The YEP today (Jan 9) has a report on pages 6 and 7 about the trollybus scheme. This link should bring up the online version:- http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/n ... -1-5296067

headingleylad · Post by **headingleylad** » Thu 10 Jan, 2013 9:01 pm

Leodian wrote: The YEP today (Jan 9) has a report on pages 6 and 7 about the trollybus scheme. This link should bring up the online version:- http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/n ... -1-5296067 Just been to the session at St Michaels School, they were quoting times of 20 minutes from Holt Park to Park Row for the Station.UNBELIEVEABLE! Also the diesel buses, including the X84 will not go around the back of the Arndale Centre, these will have to queue up with the rest of the traffic in the front of the centre, the diesel buses will not be able use the T bus lanes. They might as well terminate the X84 at the Boddington Park and Ride as passengers will transfer to the T Bus. unless of course they put the higher fare on the Folley Buses.