SKIPTON TO KINGS CROSS

Phill_dvsn · Post by **Phill_dvsn** » Sat 22 Jun, 2013 6:48 pm

cnosni wrote: raveydavey wrote: Phill_dvsn wrote: I'm a bit confused about having to have the train running in the right direction. From what I see 5A13 0447 from Neville Hill is booked High Speed Train (HST125) which of course has a running power car both ends???? It's so the posh folks in 1st class are at the front nearest the exit when it gets to London. Well yes and no.Yes so that the 1st class passengers are in the right place but also to reduce delay.The platforms have signs denoting where a particular coach should be so that passengers can be stood where their reservations are.If the set is in reverse then,so to speak,are the passnengers.This increases the dwell time at stations as passengers have to walk from one end to the other to find their reserved seat.Multiply this by the number of stops for the journey,and subsequent journeys,and you start to accumulate considerable delays.There is no where to turn a set at KX,only via Hambleton,at the bridges at Newcastle and if a service runs into Lincoln.Getting the service the right way round is very important,its all about money you see.Now i can hear you saying "Well why dont they announce it on the platforms that the train is in reverse.Two problems with this,firstly they do when a set is in reverse but no passengers seem to listen,and secondly they dont understand what it means,which if i didnt work on the railways i would not either. Yes but they are turning the set every day going on the train timings Chris? As you say they can't turn a set at Kings Cross, so it has to come back to Leeds in the right direction ready for the next days trip? First class at Kings Cross would be nearest the buffer stop, the way it went in, and less walking for passengers. So if it leaves that way, it has to get back at Neville Hill that way too.

Post by **cnosni** » Sat 22 Jun, 2013 6:51 pm

Phill_dvsn wrote: cnosni wrote: raveydavey wrote: Phill_dvsn wrote: I'm a bit confused about having to have the train running in the right direction. From what I see 5A13 0447 from Neville Hill is booked High Speed Train (HST125) which of course has a running power car both ends???? It's so the posh folks in 1st class are at the front nearest the exit when it gets to London. Well yes and no.Yes so that the 1st class passengers are in the right place but also to reduce delay.The platforms have signs denoting where a particular coach should be so that passengers can be stood where their reservations are.If the set is in reverse then,so to speak,are the passnengers.This increases the dwell time at stations as passengers have to walk from one end to the other to find their reserved seat.Multiply this by the number of stops for the journey,and subsequent journeys,and you start to accumulate considerable delays.There is no where to turn a set at KX,only via Hambleton,at the bridges at Newcastle and if a service runs into Lincoln.Getting the service the right way round is very important,its all about money you see.Now i can hear you saying "Well why dont they announce it on the platforms that the train is in reverse.Two problems with this,firstly they do when a set is in reverse but no passengers seem to listen,and secondly they dont understand what it means,which if i didnt work on the railways i would not either. Yes but they are turning the set every day going on the train timings Chris? As you say they can't turn a set at Kings Cross, so it has to come back to Leeds in the right direction ready for the next days trip? Well thats the problem Phil,the site says they are,but they are not turning the set every day.They did it on a Saturday morning for the Harrogate up til MAy,but thats finished.It was the night mans last job and believe me,its not the way to end a night shift.

Brunel · Post by **Brunel** » Sat 22 Jun, 2013 9:29 pm

And here is the return.http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y ... /advanced4 mins down @ 20:28And the 125 goes straight to bed!! after a little wait at LEEDS.http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y ... 2/advanced

Loiner1960 · Post by **Loiner1960** » Sun 23 Jun, 2013 12:53 am

I believe the right and wrong ways are for reasons of air conditioning and train maintenance. The air conditioning is set up with the north-south direction of the train sets so that the temperature inside the coaches is kept constant.Maintenance wise, the power and a/c units on the Mark 2 coaches for HST and the Mark 4 coaches for IC225's are all on the same sides, making the set directional. So when it leaves Bounds Green for KX the set is the same side for Neville Hill and all the way to Inverness. This is on the outside of the line in the cess if anything has a fault. The triangular route is so this is maintained even when used as a diversion. Having been on a HST set that did the funny Selby run to switch ends to run south.

BIG N · Post by **BIG N** » Tue 25 Jun, 2013 10:20 pm

Loiner1960 wrote: I believe the right and wrong ways are for reasons of air conditioning and train maintenance. The air conditioning is set up with the north-south direction of the train sets so that the temperature inside the coaches is kept constant.Maintenance wise, the power and a/c units on the Mark 2 coaches for HST and the Mark 4 coaches for IC225's are all on the same sides, making the set directional. So when it leaves Bounds Green for KX the set is the same side for Neville Hill and all the way to Inverness. This is on the outside of the line in the cess if anything has a fault. The triangular route is so this is maintained even when used as a diversion. Having been on a HST set that did the funny Selby run to switch ends to run south. Not entirely sure what you mean by a HST set being directional Loiner but the air con systems on the Mk 3 sets ( not Mk 2 ) are not mounted along one side only of the underframes on the stock but are accessible from both sides, and even if they were mounted on one side only they may well be on the cess side in one direction but would still be in the centre of the running lines ( the 6 foot ) on the return journey.Air con systems on all railway stock work perfectly well no matter what side of the vehicle they are mounted or what direction they are travelling - dependent on good maintainance of course.Regarding the topic of this thread - Ravey is spot on with his explination for this highly strange E.C.S. working, its simply to ensure the stock is facing the right direction once it arrives in London, not only so that the first class passengers on that journey are closest to the barriers on arrival, something that is the norm for all inter-city services arriving in the capital, but so that the set is orientated that way for the rest of the day.Its highly likely that after its arrival in the capital it will then work a return service to somewhere in Scotland before working home later in the day.Although the set works South via Garforth and Hambilton in the morning there is no balanced working via this route in the evening and the set will either work the Kings Cross - Harrogate or the Kings Cross Hull working to return to Leeds in the evening, both of which keep the formation in its correct orientation for the following day, hence the need to turn a set every day.

Phill_dvsn · Post by **Phill_dvsn** » Tue 25 Jun, 2013 10:29 pm

Here's the obvious place to turn a set roundhttp://goo.gl/maps/Hb9S4No idea why they are going miles around to do it.

Post by **cnosni** » Tue 25 Jun, 2013 11:22 pm

Phill_dvsn wrote: Here's the obvious place to turn a set roundhttp://goo.gl/maps/Hb9S4No idea why they are going miles around to do it. That would take two drivers to do that move Phil,the otehr way,going round the houses,means one driver can do it without any need to stop and change ends.Just to reiterate the point again about why this was done,it was because the Harrogate,on a Saturday morning,went via Hambleton.It left Leeds at 08:15 and the only path available at that time was via Hambleton.Nothing to do with air con,just a way to get the set the right way round on its journey south and subsequent journeys.