Is this...

Brunel · Post by **Brunel** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 12:37 pm

The author of the article below is Melway Transport: courtesy of the Leeds Transport Touring Group Newsletter."THE LEEDS AND BRADFORD TRAM EXPERIMENTBetween 1909 and 1918 an inventive inter-city tram service ran between Leeds and Bradford. Before the through service started Bradford trams terminated at Stanningley Bottom, whilst Leeds trams turned left up Richardshaw Lane towards Pudsey. The travelling public found it inconvenient to transfer from a Leeds to a Bradford tram especially in adverse weather. The major stumbling block was the gauges of the two systems with Leeds adopting a 4ft.81/2 gauge and Bradford a 4ft gauge, which made inter running impossible.Leeds City Tramways approached Bradford Corporation with the proposal of laying a third rail along the whole road between the two cities, with both cities sharing the costs of £30,000. Bradford was not keen on the idea and used the cost of the scheme as a get out, so the proposals were dropped.All was not lost, Bradford's Tramways manager C.J. Spencer and his assistant J.W. Dawson came up with a idea of creating a variable tramcar bogie, which would automatically change the gauge of the wheels.A tapered track was laid between the two systems at Stanningley bottom and on 21st January 1907 the first trail run took place between Thornbury Depot and Branch Road Bramley. Further extensive experimental trials took place between 1907and 1908. After much fine tuning, a through service finally commenced on 6th June 1909. The inauguration of the new service took place the day before with a Leeds tram meeting with a Bradford tram at the Leeds City and Pudsey Borough boundary at Stanningley. The respective Lord Mayors of both cities drove their cities tram to a civic luncheon in Bradford. The trams used were Leeds 108 and Bradford 118.You would have thought that everything was Rosie in both camps of the respective tramway departments, but although the service was well patronised the paying public preferred to ride on the Leeds trams which were a much better ride. It was soon apparent that Leeds was not happy about the way the receipts were divided up. Leeds agued as most of the route was within the Leeds city boundary they should get more of the split, but Bradford refuted the idea. Pudsey Borough Council became involved when the residents of Stanningley and Farsley complained bitterly that they paid higher fares on the Bradford trams.Leeds proposed that it should go to arbitration, but once again Bradford declined.During the First World War there was increasing problems with the track maintenance and the infrastructure... This caused major trouble's with the rolling stock, with Bradford duel cars being the worst affected.The end came suddenly on 25th March 1918; there was no traffic notices issued and no announcement in the press. The service just stopped running, so, once again Leeds trams continued up Richardshaw Lane to Pudsey and Bradford trams terminating at Stanningley.Efforts were made to resurrect through running and Leeds retained there batch of dual gauge cars. Leeds wanted it to happen, but once again Bradford would not play ball.It was rumoured that the dual gauge trams were very costly to run and although Leeds had greater resources to keep their trams in good working condition Bradford Corporation was not too unhappy to see the end of experiment as it was a big drain on its tramway budget.So ended a unique tramway experiment it all began with civic pride and grandeur and ended in feeble silence and inter city bickering.Unlike the Greater Manchester, East Lancashire and the Merseyside corridor, West Yorkshire had a mixture of tram gauges which prevented large scale inter urban running. In many cases in West Yorkshire tram systems met each other at various locations, but once again the gauges were the big stumbling block.

Si · Post by Si » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 2:37 pm

Uno Hoo wrote: Thanks, Si. Got the full picture now. It is the top of Calverley Cutting.Yes, the brick building was (is) an air-raid shelter. I don't know at what stage these things become dysfunctional, or why they've never been demolished.My maternal grandfather used to say the same about being able to travel from Leeds to Liverpool by tram, except for one stretch, presumably somewhere in the Pennine district, which he said was walkable. Probably was in his time, when people walked long distances as a matter of routine - my mother used to talk of walking from Farsley to Calverley & Rodley station for a train to Otley, from whence she and her parents would walk to Darley for a holiday on a farm there. I thought it must be. I went to school at Waterloo Junior School in Pudsey in the 60s, and there was an air-raid shelter in the playground of exactly the same design.Talking of long walks past....my neighbour, who died a few years ago in his eighties, spoke of when he was a child (living in Otley,) and his dad was a steam-roller driver working on the roads. He (his dad) had been working up Norwood Edge laying the road six days a week. He had to get up very early on a Sunday morning, and walk all the way up there to stoke the steamroller, so it wouldn't be out of steam come Monday morning! Unpaid of course.

Johnny39 · Post by **Johnny39** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 4:40 pm

I may be going slightly off the thread here but the talk about Leeds/Bradford trams brought back to my mind a letter which, if my memory serves me correctly, used to appear regularly in the YEP/YEN. It was the question, "was it possible to travel from Leeds to Blackpool by tram?" Surprisingly the answer was yes, it was possible. Don't ask me the route but it was usually published with the questioning letter. From what I recall it took a lowland route from the West Riding into industrial Lancashire with reasonably short walks between transportation. Can anyone else recall seeing this question & answer and perhaps remembers the route?

Post by **tyke bhoy** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 5:03 pm

Pondered and somewhat refuted in this thread<<http://www.secretleeds.com/forum/Messag ... ighLight=1>>

Johnny39 · Post by **Johnny39** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 5:45 pm

Thanks Tykebhoy appreciate that.

Trojan · Post by **Trojan** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 9:19 pm

Uno Hoo wrote: Leeds had cut back to Half Mile Lane, and Bradford had replaced them with trolleybuses and motorbuses along Leeds Road quite soon after WW2. I can just remember the Bradford trams. We caught one at the top of Dudley Hill and the ends were open, it rattled and banged and frightened me (who must have been less than 5)

Uno Hoo · Post by **Uno Hoo** » Thu 23 Jul, 2009 11:58 pm

Trojan wrote: Uno Hoo wrote: Leeds had cut back to Half Mile Lane, and Bradford had replaced them with trolleybuses and motorbuses along Leeds Road quite soon after WW2. I can just remember the Bradford trams. We caught one at the top of Dudley Hill and the ends were open, it rattled and banged and frightened me (who must have been less than 5) I can recall riding on Bradford trams only once. My sister and I were taken up Great Horton Road, riding in the front open balcony. I remember the conductor giving the starting signals by blowing a whistle. We must have alighted at Horton Bank Top, as I remember walking down a steep lane to a park with swings. It was not until I got married in 1969 and went to live at Horton Bank Top that I realised we would have walked down Hollingwood Lane to Brackenhill Park - to which I've never been since.